Is the game over?

[netzerkaiser]

Seriously, looking at the brave posts, stand up DAPAddict, & the lack of new movies etc, is it over? If it is, then thanks for the ride.

No accusations anywhere, business models are business models, but it'd be nice to cash my 1000+ tickets out in style. The seriousness of situation only dawned on me today when I saw no updates.

Just please let us know, is it over or what?

Just let us know.

[misangrenegra2]

Seriously, looking at the brave posts, stand up DAPAddict, & the lack of new movies etc, is it over? If it is, then thanks for the ride.

No accusations anywhere, business models are business models, but it'd be nice to cash my 1000+ tickets out in style. The seriousness of situation only dawned on me today when I saw no updates.

Just please let us know, is it over or what?

Just let us know.

I don't see the apocalypse anywhere, were 2 days and checking the released in the last 4-5 days, everything looks normal.

[netzerkaiser]

Seriously, looking at the brave posts, stand up DAPAddict, & the lack of new movies etc, is it over? If it is, then thanks for the ride.

No accusations anywhere, business models are business models, but it'd be nice to cash my 1000+ tickets out in style. The seriousness of situation only dawned on me today when I saw no updates.

Just please let us know, is it over or what?

Just let us know.

I don't see the apocalypse anywhere, were 2 days and checking the released in the last 4-5 days, everything looks normal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtpvikPvewk

[isis666xxx]

the game will be over when zelenski conquers crimea

i love you netzerkaiser dear ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥

[jerrybb]

Why the negativity?
You are on the best porn site on the world.

[nilis]

No. More like...

[Paizal]

Why the negativity?
You are on the best porn site on the world.

For all the jaded robot wankers who buy the same old scene every day at completely absurd prices - maybe.

[dap-addict]

Just please let us know, is it over or what?
Just let us know.

Its not over, but indeed I am worried about gonzo closure, xxx health and Giorgio claiming six digit losses in 2023.

[netzerkaiser]

Just please let us know, is it over or what?
Just let us know.

Its not over, but indeed I am worried about gonzo closure, xxx health and Giorgio claiming six digit losses in 2023.

Thanks. I wish XXX good health & I'm sorry ton hear of Giorgio's losses - he always strikes me as a basically decent man... I wish you all well. Maybe its time to go after the elephant in the room, the fileshare sites? If I was running the show, you can be sure I'd have done that years ago. Then videos would probably cost 5 times less than they do now.

Happy Christmas DAPAddict, you're one of the good guys.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLbsZ8tUehE

[isis666xxx]

I'm sorry ton hear of Giorgio's losses

what losses???

[Sweep11]

I’ve had the same thoughts for a few months now.
As you rightly said, no blame anywhere but it feels like the end.
Fewer new faces, fewer professional studios, fewer new scenes, more 1 on 1, more amateur crap, more freak show nastiness, massive price rises.
I have bought so few scenes lately and don’t get the same excitement when checking the updates.
Maybe it’s me, not them. I’ve been using porn a long time. Perhaps I’m jaded. Perhaps like my fashion choices, I’m too old to enjoy what others think is great.
Kudos and good health and wealth to xxx, Giorgio and the others that made the dream last so long.
It was a hell of a ride.

[isis666xxx]

the one that was really in a game over was PH after deleting 10 million videos

that was like self-nuke or something

and horrible because those 10 million videos's value was beyond extreme

[zeusanalfreak299]

Seriously, looking at the brave posts, stand up DAPAddict, & the lack of new movies etc, is it over? If it is, then thanks for the ride.

No accusations anywhere, business models are business models, but it'd be nice to cash my 1000+ tickets out in style. The seriousness of situation only dawned on me today when I saw no updates.

Just please let us know, is it over or what?

Just let us know.

This is the reason I filled up with 42 TKT for 28€. And cancelled until everything was spent.
Plus, there wasnt enough interesting scenes for me to fill up my TKT monthly.
And: Everytime I check the new updates and the forum I expect ot see something like "We are done, thanks for everything, take care! "

[YuriyProneBone]

and Giorgio claiming six digit losses in 2023.

He needs to cut prices in half if he wants people to come back, then he needs to wait for people to come back because even with low prices it takes a lot of time for people to regain the trust. It is a risk he may not be willing to do. But that's the only way out. Those prices are unsustainable in today's economy. I would say that if you are not growing you are shrinking and those prices are shrinking the base.

The biggest concern here is that cutting 50% is not enough. He charges 15tk, if he cuts 50% that's 10tk, still not enough. It sucks but he needs to be in the 6 to 7 ticket range and wait log time for people to come back. It is the only way I see other than going the subscription route.

[isis666xxx]

I'm sorry ton hear of Giorgio's losses

what losses???

sorry i didnt readed the post of dap addict above

im dumb

[isis666xxx]

this website is still high

u pessimist losers

[dap-addict]

I'm sorry ton hear of Giorgio's losses

what losses???

sorry i didnt readed the post of dap addict above

im dumb

You are not dumb, but please read and watch first and than write!
Please start to find your way into some fruitful discussion here and not just talk to talk and write to write! You obviously know a lot of older porn, this is a value added, but you have to add it and start to treat this forum not as your time killer but a discussion place! Thanks!

[misangrenegra2]

I'm the first who would like that the scenes cost a little bit less and the TKTs recieved in the membership were a little bit more, the "problem" is that the quantity didn't change but the price for an scene did it.

Reduce the prices of the current scenes in a 50% is too much, would be more realistic put the scene between 11-13 TKTs, and the 1on1 between 6'5-8 but i guess that is not possible

A lot of people just decides to focus their purchases in old content that didn't reduce their price, maybe could be an opportunity offer the old content (since 3 years back) with some discount of 10-15% of the price, maybe some users would decide to buy it and support in their own way to the studio, but i don't think that the magic formula try to get an incredible profit focusing the attention in how to sell the old content.

Is hard to accept because a lot of people is angry by the prices but.. when more support to the site, better for everyone.

This is a bussiness that offer us a content that we want to watch in exchange of our money, i know that not everyone is agree with the prices but this is not the goverment of a country on the folks decides to stop their support and takes the streets to expect changes. A bussiness needs be supported to offer better conditions.

Of course is neccesary discuss what things are wrong and be try to find things to improve to recover the loyalty of the costumers and get new ones costumers to support the site.

[dap-addict]

and Giorgio claiming six digit losses in 2023.

He needs to cut prices in half if he wants people to come back...

Nobody knows how much GIO and other studios need to cut prices to sell enough scenes more to compensate for the loss. Would be easy ofc if they knew that cutting by 50% they will have 200% rise of sales. But it's not that easy!

Also TKT prices here are still for most studios a fare share of investment passed on to users, i.e. more expensive scenes because of more demanding sex acts and more studs involved also cost more. That currently means that a scene which cost 8TKT 30months ago, costs now around 13-14TKT, which means price for new same scenes based on 5on1 wet DAP went suddenly up to 10,8TKT in April 2022, and since then another 20-25%, but proportionally its still a fair investor>user transfer.

I tend to see the initial problem in that unheralded TKT price rise not by than 19% inflation in Czech Rep., but by as much as 35%. That was too much at once, and same important, nobody was announcing it before. Again like with that 2-day-release stop a few days ago, users first had to ask before xxx cared to answer - and on top than answers were not understandable first, like xxx tried to hide what was happening really.
That cost all studios a lot of credibility, not only GIO!

[dap-addict]

edit:
That cost all studios and also xxx a lot trust!
And I do actually wonder who advised them to act than like they did? Was there any counseling at all? Later it looked like most important stakeholders didnt talk to each other before and many important producers were as surprised by that de facto 35% TKT price rise as porn consumers and loyal customers.

I really dont get how xxx could destroy so much trust so lightheartedly!

[Buck_Meister]

Can only get a sense of utter satisfaction and delight at the news of one of the worst porn producers hemorrhaging money
Guess his piss-only, zero pussy crap is working it's lil magic
Can only hope he keeps shooting such garbage that would get his coffin nailed big time
I mean who the heck would shoot porn without pussy fucking for a straight audience and expect making billions... that's stupidity taken to the next level
You pay on actress high rate at least make full usage of her every holes and get a variety of fucking positions instead of that monotonous reruns of the same pissing shit over and over

[Giorgio Grandi]

and Giorgio claiming six digit losses in 2023.

He needs to cut prices in half if he wants people to come back...

Nobody knows how much GIO and other studios need to cut prices to sell enough scenes more to compensate for the loss. Would be easy ofc if they knew that cutting by 50% they will have 200% rise of sales. But it's not that easy!

Also TKT prices here are still for most studios a fare share of investment passed on to users, i.e. more expensive scenes because of more demanding sex acts and more studs involved also cost more. That currently means that a scene which cost 8TKT 30months ago, costs now around 13-14TKT, which means price for new same scenes based on 5on1 wet DAP went suddenly up to 10,8TKT in April 2022, and since then another 20-25%, but proportionally its still a fair investor>user transfer.

I tend to see the initial problem in that unheralded TKT price rise not by than 19% inflation in Czech Rep., but by as much as 35%. That was too much at once, and same important, nobody was announcing it before. Again like with that 2-day-release stop a few days ago, users first had to ask before xxx cared to answer - and on top than answers were not understandable first, like xxx tried to hide what was happening really.
That cost all studios a lot of credibility, not only GIO!

Yea, there are other reason on the top of everything getting more expensive
Last 2 years or so were ridiculous. Lots of studios popping out, trying to shoot the same content I was doing ( or "we did", I mean a couple of studios) even with the same models (instead than find their own models, which would have been great). On the top of this, the way they got the models, was just offering more money (more money than what was already an overpaid payout). The result now, with a worldwide crisis and lot of studios out of business or in trouble, are lots of models out of our range as they clearly do not agree to work for the previous price. There has never been a single year that I can remember like 2023, where so many models are no longer regular on this site and we will never have them back.

Some studio have just been a calamity for the PB environment, they did not invest a single cent in what needed to be done (the recruiting), but maybe instead they invested in external projects. Just vampires that took away resources from who was filling this environment for years with girls and content.

but you know the news? I have broad shoulders and iron balls, I am going to find the new girls and put vampires in the place where they belong

[Kslvt]

Thank you for your honest response Giorgio because many people have questions.

I think I absolutely see which studios you are talking about, when you use the term "vampires" and it is indeed that they benefit from the visibility of pornbox without investing in the general development of the site.

Your studio was a pioneer in the porn that I love, I hope you will do what it takes to continue to make us dream!

[visigoth2020260]

but you know the news? I have broad shoulders and iron balls, I am going to find the new girls and put vampires in the place where they belong

If it is at all possible to steal Nela from AGS, do it.
My Warden series belongs to her.
I must not post my ideas here.
The vamps are out to suck.

[Jocke]

I have worked quite a bit with business optimisation but unfortunately I don't know enough to make a certain diagnosis. I have some ideas though.

1. I don't subscribe to OF but my understanding is that a lot of business end up there. From the girls who are successful we hear that they never knew they could make this kind of money. Apparently many customers are addicted and ready to pay obscene amounts for rather poorly shot porn.

2. It also seems like live chats like Chaturbate is taking a big share of the market.

So what are the reasons for their successes and could understanding some of those reasons help studio porn regain business?
I can only guess but I suspect that they provide much more intimacy, even if some of it is fake. The more direct interaction with the models the more real the experience and the more addictive.

What is missing?
I think the models here are too anonymous. In the scenes they are not allowed to show their personality but are directed in detail. Once in a while you get a model who breaks the mould and do more as they want themselves, not just being fuck dolls. Many of those girls with a personality tend to stay longer and become interesting to follow in new scenes as opposed to being boring after three scenes.

What can be done?
Look for girls who have more of a personality and let them flourish. Let them flirt with the camera, let them joke and have fun with the other performers (as in the BTS). Interview them before and after a scene. Let them talk about their plans, their life, their work etc.. Same with the guys, let them introduce themselves and comment on scenes etc.
Make sure they comment on their model page and engage with other commenters. Provide links to their social media on their model page. Let them administrate their model page themselves so that they can provide more info, more pictures and decide how they will be presented themselves.

[Jocke]

I had to abbreviate OF to post!!!
This is another problem. This forum pretends that the surrounding world doesn't exist.

[Jocke]

When it comes to prices it is important to understand that the pricing opportunity is based on one thing, convenience! It is not mainly how great the scenes are, which they obviously have to be but the difference in convenience between watching a free copy and the original.

"Free" sites have an awful lot of ads. They have increased risks of virus. They often have lower resolution. They have bad download options. They do not have the full list of scenes. etc...
However for a lot of people that is still better than paying. I prefer to pay to get a better experience and to support the business, but I also have a threshold for when it becomes too expensive.

I think €70/quarter is fine, that is like twice or three times a traditional site. I could even pay a bit more, but at current rates, that is like three scenes per month, not even one per week.

The result is that we have a lot of guys with a subscription, who wouldn't mind watching a new scene every day but cannot afford it. The scenes gets a low watch rate which is stupid as the cost is already sunk.

My guess is that most customers would be prepared to pay twice their quarterly subscription fee if all the material was free, like on a traditional site.

[dap-addict]

Again like with that 2-day-release stop a few days ago, users first had to ask before xxx cared to answer - and on top than answers were not understandable first, like xxx tried to hide what was happening really.
That cost all studios a lot of credibility, not only GIO!

Yea, there are other reason on the top of everything getting more expensive
Last 2 years or so were ridiculous. Lots of studios popping out, trying to shoot the same content I was doing ( or "we did", I mean a couple of studios) even with the same models (instead than find their own models, which would have been great). On the top of this, the way they got the models, was just offering more money (more money than what was already an overpaid payout). The result now, with a worldwide crisis and lot of studios out of business or in trouble, are lots of models out of our range as they clearly do not agree to work for the previous price.

Thanks Giorgio for late honesty!
It was one of hypothesis that price rise was also aimed at excluding smaller studios again. That worked and we both know who you talk about. Both of them didnt scout 1 single model themselves, or maybe 1-2 they did at max, all others they canibalized.

Still, we have also to ask was such a big - and unheralded - ticked devaluation = price rise worth it? Because still the backfire is also big and small innovative scouting studios lost a lot of customers. And LP lost a lot of trust!

[Seraph0257]

the one that was really in a game over was PH after deleting 10 million videos

that was like self-nuke or something

and horrible because those 10 million videos's value was beyond extreme

I was a premium member when that happened. One day all was available, amatuer videos were everywhere, next, hardly anything. A year or so later, Premium was still in the shitter, but normal PH was full of videos. Guess the lack of download feature let them have a little more wiggle room.

[lp-fan]

According the updates from day to day you get more and more the feeling. Yes it's over.

[isis666xxx]

the one that was really in a game over was PH after deleting 10 million videos

that was like self-nuke or something

and horrible because those 10 million videos's value was beyond extreme

I was a premium member when that happened. One day all was available, amatuer videos were everywhere, next, hardly anything. A year or so later, Premium was still in the shitter, but normal PH was full of videos. Guess the lack of download feature let them have a little more wiggle room.

it was one of the worst catasthrophes in the history of the internet, the value of those 10.000.000 videos was beyond extreme

curse PH

[lp-fan]

Please Giorgio explain to us what's up with the wondertoys studio and why we have no pee drinking from glasses anymore?

[lp-fan]

It gets really really boring here!!!

[drevokocur66]

and Giorgio claiming six digit losses in 2023.

He needs to cut prices in half if he wants people to come back, then he needs to wait for people to come back because even with low prices it takes a lot of time for people to regain the trust. It is a risk he may not be willing to do. But that's the only way out. Those prices are unsustainable in today's economy. I would say that if you are not growing you are shrinking and those prices are shrinking the base.

The biggest concern here is that cutting 50% is not enough. He charges 15tk, if he cuts 50% that's 10tk, still not enough. It sucks but he needs to be in the 6 to 7 ticket range and wait log time for people to come back. It is the only way I see other than going the subscription route.

For me, it's the content trust. THe more bullshit you pull, the longer it will take to get people back.

[Alan2008]

and Giorgio claiming six digit losses in 2023.

Yea, there are other reason on the top of everything getting more expensive
Last 2 years or so were ridiculous. Lots of studios popping out, trying to shoot the same content I was doing ( or "we did", I mean a couple of studios) even with the same models (instead than find their own models, which would have been great). On the top of this, the way they got the models, was just offering more money (more money than what was already an overpaid payout). The result now, with a worldwide crisis and lot of studios out of business or in trouble, are lots of models out of our range as they clearly do not agree to work for the previous price. There has never been a single year that I can remember like 2023, where so many models are no longer regular on this site and we will never have them back.

Some studio have just been a calamity for the PB environment, they did not invest a single cent in what needed to be done (the recruiting), but maybe instead they invested in external projects. Just vampires that took away resources from who was filling this environment for years with girls and content.

but you know the news? I have broad shoulders and iron balls, I am going to find the new girls and put vampires in the place where they belong

I have just seen this thread. Firstly a Happy New Year to you and hope it is way better than 2023 !!!! We are all hoping that you get over the gremlins of 2023 pretty quickly. Also from my perspective I am spending 2-3x the amount that I spent on tickets before the crisis and will try to support whenever possible. But I must admit I don't mind paying a high fee for somebody like Rebel Rhyder as I know I am alsways going to get a lot of bang for my buck. I also feel sad for Gonzo studio and thought that they priced the shoots very competitively without compromising on quality. However we don't know the full story of Gonzos reasons for closure. Hopefully you will know if they priced their shoots competitively/successfully and if their pricing policy is something that you would consider for 2024.

[Alan2008]

I should have added that nobody should forget that SVB went bankrupt in early 2023. So there are many consequences of that catastrophic financial event. Maybe the anticipated US market is much weaker than what LP/AV anticipated and not hotting the expected targets. So maybe need to look for new markets in 2024.......

[Evil_Del]

It's called the UBERIZATION of porn.

I remember I talked about it 2 years ago already in another thread about porn future perspectives.

Onlyfan, Mym, Chaturbate etc are destroying the conventional studios. Female talents begin by creating a fanbase on inst-ag-ram or tiktok or whatever and then sell their stuffs directly to the consumer.
Porn "stars" leave the conventional studios after a few scenes (just the time to get famous)

Girls want to do what they want, and how they want. Shift of power.

cheap amateurish studios filming desperate favela girls or war refugees, "vampire studios", and hyperspecialized niche hardcore studios will thrive, middle of the pack to high end ones will perish.

The studios that will survive are the ones filming super high end quality with themes appealing to the majority (like Blacked)

Good luck to Gio and his balls of steel, maybe you could try to recruit chaturbate girls before they go escort in the middle east and make them stars, but keep in mind they will turn their back on you on the first occasion, that's today's world.

[Pineapples Studio]

Yea, there are other reason on the top of everything getting more expensive
Last 2 years or so were ridiculous. Lots of studios popping out, trying to shoot the same content I was doing ( or "we did", I mean a couple of studios) even with the same models (instead than find their own models, which would have been great). On the top of this, the way they got the models, was just offering more money (more money than what was already an overpaid payout). The result now, with a worldwide crisis and lot of studios out of business or in trouble, are lots of models out of our range as they clearly do not agree to work for the previous price. There has never been a single year that I can remember like 2023, where so many models are no longer regular on this site and we will never have them back.

Some studio have just been a calamity for the PB environment, they did not invest a single cent in what needed to be done (the recruiting), but maybe instead they invested in external projects. Just vampires that took away resources from who was filling this environment for years with girls and content.

but you know the news? I have broad shoulders and iron balls, I am going to find the new girls and put vampires in the place where they belong

It’s OnlyScams. That’s the root cause of the problem and we all know it. I don’t think producers sniping models from one another is a real issue, but I suppose you know more than me.

The idea of models being exclusive to one studio is relatively new in porn if we forget about companies like Vivid or Digital Playground. Lots and lots of small-time producers lack the resources to recruit their own models and rely on talent from agencies or freelance bookings. This has always been the case. If you’re going to blame someone for that situation, then blame the models for pursuing those opportunities.

Not sure which studios you’re saying caused major problems, though.

[xxxVIPERxxx]

Just please let us know, is it over or what?
Just let us know.

Its not over, but indeed I am worried about gonzo closure, xxx health and Giorgio claiming six digit losses in 2023.

It is quite normal for some big companies to make a 6 to 8 figure loss in a financial year.
However, I understand that GIO studios would of course suffer if they made a 100,000 Euro + loss in one year...however, I am not sure if that value is right.

I always got the impression that on balance, they were still doing okay...

[Pineapples Studio]

Just please let us know, is it over or what?
Just let us know.

Its not over, but indeed I am worried about gonzo closure, xxx health and Giorgio claiming six digit losses in 2023.

Why are you worried about xxx health?