So which is the real reason of LP/AV is dying?

[kuaheyden513]

Low sales? Costs doesn't worth it? Not enough girls? Too many ugly gay guys in the website main page ?
Why? Why is it over? Don't tell me that is because 0nIyf4ans cuz' that's not true.

[bake0213]

1. OnlyScams taking a big slice of the model pie
2. Members preference of only buying scenes that contain DAP/Piss/Prolapse/Puke
3. Issues in Russia

There's no longer a sustainable model base here as a result. This is why you saw the same tired models over and over. These were the ones that the core customer here was willing to buy and so we got them over and over until they ran their course as well. The "good news" is that this site is probably not actually dying. It's just getting it's revenue from other types of content.

[Chimpy.677]

I've already said the reasons a million times, these are the 3 main reasons:

1) The site has become a site where the only thing that matters is piss, vomit and prolapses. Women and sex don't matter, we can see this all the time, where if a new scene comes out and it doesn't have piss, vomit and prolapses people complain about it.

2) The strange taste that the users of the site have: they always prefer mature and not so pretty women to young and beautiful girls. It's like they have a broken sense of good taste.

3) They ask for a million times for scenes of the same model doing the same thing over and over and over again. It's an incredible thing, it seems that they don't get tired of seeing the same thing constantly.

[dap-addict]

3. Issues in Russia

There's no longer a sustainable model base here as a result. This is why you saw the same tired models over and over. These were the ones that the core customer here was willing to buy and so we got them over and over until they ran their course as well.

They didnt run their course yet, but they are too expensive.
War basically stopped the Russian import and Ukrainian girls didnt turn up to tip the scales into balance again. Import from Latin America proofed too expensive, girls sell at 7-10TKTs but not prices GIO needed to get investment back again.

Compare GIO models provenience in 2019-21 with 2022-24!
Its devastating!
Also last GIO adventure trying to import Russian girls to Serbia to shoot them there shows they tried a way out based on Russian girls, but done 2 years too late wouldn't work out anymore.

OF is a cheap excuse only!
OF analysis favors cheap scouting actually.
Also DAP + piss is scapegoating again like anal creameries in the 2007(?) US HIV outbreak

[hyapet]

You say you don't want to hear that it's because of "OF" - but the consequences from it have just been so far reaching - that it effects every other single thing mentioned by everyone else.

What moved the sales needle in the past? Was it the scene types (DP/DAP/Puke/Piss)? Sure. That had something to do with it. Was it the types of cameras that were used and the shots that were used? No doubt that also played a small role. But, more than anything, it was the girls.

When a girl like Nikki Hill would show up - and then go from a single anal scene to a BBC DAP - it was like ... we were getting spoiled. But - this set the new baseline. This is what people expected from that point forward. And, for better or for worse, it's what's the site delivered on a nearly regular basis. All the way up until NRX closed it's doors - we were getting scenes with beauties we couldn't believe were actually there doing what they were doing - doing what they were actually doing. Again ... spoiled.

So, when Russia closed it's doors, that was bad enough. It could have been repairable. If the traditional porn market was still healthy. But - it wasn't. Like a vacuum, OF sucked up all girls that were an 8 out of 10 or higher. Leaving sites that required things like taking two baseball bats up the rear at the same time - to the folks who were decidedly below those standards.

No longer were we getting the Nikki Hills. But, rather, a bunch of girls who, if not suffering from drug addictions, looked like billboards of bad taste with tattoo'd bodies up the wazoo, dangerously low weight, and gigantic fake plastic tits. The left-overs of basement level back alley porno shoots in the past became the main course over at PB/AV. And even then - when they eventually got the girl's level up (as it is far better these days than it's been), it still hasn't hit that same high of these creamy milky white innocent teens getting tossed around by a bunch of black dudes.

Added to this - the going rate for these girl's increased - because the girl's themselves were in short supply.

So - for decreased sales - and increased rates for the girl's themselves - you're getting what you're getting. Lots of studios hearts just aren't in it anymore, because rather than grabbing some beauty they can't believe is actually doing porn, they're grabbing girl's who, when looking at them, shooting porn makes perfect sense, and ... doesn't get anybody too excited.

Either the people buying the shoots - or the people actually doing the shoots.

So ... I dunno what you want to hear.

Like - it's not over. AV/PB will survive. South America is still doing incredible stuff. The girl's they're getting in Europe are actually pretty decent now. And they're starting to come around on getting more beautiful girls that are from the OF talent pool - even if converting them to the mainstay DAP attractions of the site are difficult.

There are lots of days where ... there isn't much happening. And the "leader of the pack" of "unbelievably hot girls" doesn't ... really exist anymore. There is no 10/10 that's shooting incredibly ladder-rung breaking porn at the moment. It is a lull. It's a down moment.

But, it's a business. And if they're interested in surviving - they'll learn how to make the contracts with the girl's more modern - in that the girl's get a chunk of the sales that their scenes make. It's the only way to attract the level of beauties that once existed here - as well as finding a new batch of producers like GIO and Nick Whitehard. It's a big hill to climb.

But, it's a business. They're not going to shrug and be like, "Well, this isn't easy anymore, so, let's give up." They've been fucking trying. Like, not everything can be a home-run. But, after the NRX/EKS closures, there were a lot of strike-outs. Then, they started hitting some singles. Even doubles here and there. Then a triple every once and again. And recently, with scenes like the Hayek sisters or Ruby Walker, the actual home run now and again.

It's not fucking easy when your whole business transforms/collapses overnight. It doesn't mean they're completely finished. It also doesn't mean they're at the top of their game. They're in a transition period. And, it matters now more than ever to support them. But - that only realistically works if they produce content that's worth supporting.

And all things being considered - they have been trying their hardest. Could it be better? Definitely? Are we still in the relatively worst portion of the lull the site has ever seen? Kind of, yes. But ... is it over?

Not with the progress they've been making.

Completely reinventing your business model takes time. One day, though, an absolutely incredible OF beauty will come through and shoot a BBC DAP breaking scene with a new producer, like an Anne De Ville or something, and it will be incredible. And then, thanks to the new monetization method they've got working then, a lot of other OF models will see AV/PB as an actual pay-day. And then - over the course of like three months - you'll be getting some of the most mind-bending, dick-exploding porn you've ever seen.

It takes time to get there, though. It takes time to make studios. It takes time to come up with new techniques for talent acquisition. It takes time to learn how to navigate the changing laws of the markets you're working for. And it takes even more time when you have to do all of those things at the same time.

But, just because it's a transition, doesn't mean it's over.

Give these guys some credit.

They've earned that much.

[Evil_Del]

1) Chaturbate and Onlyfan are DESTROYING oldschool porn. Beautiful women make 100 times more money without having to get their anus destroyed at 25yo and taking gallons of cum/piss on the face. Only trashy less-attractive girls do porn now (at least in Europe)

2) Consequence of 1) : the studios must go SUPER NICHE to attract people (Piss became mainstream in a matter of a year or two, so they have to film gross buttroses, idiotic food/vomit scenes, going super heavy on gay/trans cheap porn etc)

3) Consequence of 2) They attract a bunch of weirdos and borderline mentally ill customers that want even more specific fetishes to be handed to them and complain all the freaking time. Those people have a short "sexual span" attention and want more and more extreme/completely gooffy stuff.

4) Most of the studios have a bunch of delusional amateurs at the helm thinking they are big shot artists and business men when in reality they suck and produce dog food.

[jjwhite1985]

The people saying OF and similar platforms are 100% correct. This is the absolute number one reason for LP failing financially. Performers can make far more money than they ever could at LP for easier work, plus a whole host of other benefits. This effects their rate and what they are/aren't willing to do for scenes, and probably also effects the demand from consumers for "professional" porn. All of this makes LP's business model unsustainable.

[Giorgio Grandi]

There are no problems financially here
Regular models sells good and make good money for herself and for the producer.

We don’t have new models, the reason is that on OF a big slice of dudes pay 20$ for a 15 minutes video of a girls alone without anal and 50-100$/minute for a custom video. This bring every model with a bit of brain to make several thousand dollars/month without to struggle. Good models to make dozen of thousand/month.
You don’t understand the scale of this.

On the other side YOU DO NOT pay 40$ for a dap with pee or 30 for a dp, so a producer here cant offer 6000$ to a model for a dap pee and 4000 for a dp, but just a normal payout that is not interesting if you already have a good regular income

This is how it is.

[Chimpy.677]

There are no problems financially here
Regular models sells good and make good money for herself and for the producer.

We don’t have new models, the reason is that on OF a big slice of dudes pay 20$ for a 15 minutes video of a girls alone without anal and 50-100$/minute for a custom video. This bring every model with a bit of brain to make several thousand dollars/month without to struggle. Good models to make dozen of thousand/month.
You don’t understand the scale of this.

On the other side YOU DO NOT pay 40$ for a dap with pee or 30 for a dp, so a producer here cant offer 6000$ to a model for a dap pee and 4000 for a dp, but just a normal payout that is not interesting if you already have a good regular income

This is how it is.

There is nothing more boring than porn from sites like OF, literally if I only had to watch porn from there I would never watch porn again, I don't understand people who pay for that.

That's why I always thought that the business is in this:

People who buy soft scenes of beautiful girls from OF I'm sure they would want to see them doing DP/DAP scenes and would pay much higher amounts to see those scenes and that's where those girls could agree to do those videos. The problem is that those girls obviously don't have the infrastructure to do those kinds of professional scenes and that's where the business would be, where studios like the ones here at AV can get in to do those scenes by making agreements with the girls from sites like OF.
In fact I think that the biggest turn-on for the clients of those sites is seeing their favorite girls doing extreme scenes, going from doing soft anal sex scenes to hard DP/DAP sex.
Basically what I'm saying is that the clients aren't here but on sites like OF or similar.

[YuriyProneBone]

Probably Only Fans, buy also lack of consistency from buyers. For example I notice that if I stop buying videos from a Studio something usually happy to that studio soon. I'm only one costumer, but I imagine this happens because if I stop buying others like me also stop buying. I consider myself I'm average buyer, so maybe that's why this happens.

Now the reasons why I stop buying is because higher prices, I become selective, studios can survive on selective, but they only thrive when costumers buy mostly everything they put out. The problem with selective is that if you stop, the studio stops altogether. What happens is that higher prices makes you become cheap with your money.

The other issue is that we the costumers are very spoiled, we forget that inflation hits everything, so we can't expect porn to keep prices in times like this just because other entertainment industries do it. Then there are subscription based sites that have become cheaper with time, so the comparison makes higher prices look unfair when in reality producers are simply trying to break even because of the higher costs of making a scene.

Ultimately Only Fans is the bigger problem, and we costumers been trained for decades with the wrong expectations when it comes to pricing the other smaller problem.

[dap-addict]

On the other side YOU DO NOT pay 40$ for a dap with pee, so a producer here cant offer 6000$ to a model for a dap pee, but just a normal payout that is not interesting if you already have a good regular income

This is how it is.

But not all OF girls have a regular income!

Also for some very attractive OF girls (I dont even know because I dont pay for OF and never will do) I would pay 40$ for DAPbreakin'. Maybe I should make a poll about it?

[hyapet]

There is nothing more boring than porn from sites like OF, literally if I only had to watch porn from there I would never watch porn again, I don't understand people who pay for that.

You don't understand. Really, 100%, not trying to sound like an asshole here. But the truth is, you're a market that is more "traditional" when it comes to your porn tastes and preferences.

The newer market is made up of soy-boys and fem-boys who get turned on by getting permission from someone to masturbate. Men who've had their own self-worth mocked and threatened since they first learned how to talk - and who've internalized these lessons into "just being who they are." The traditional man who fantasizes about giving a girl that absolute hardest most ravaging fucking she's ever received is on the decline. As is testosterone in men in general.

For lots of men, these OF girls even acknowledging they exist is the biggest turn on they could imagine. Truth is - they wouldn't purchase the kind of porn AV/PB produces anyways. They wouldn't even understand what they're looking at. That's no one's fault. It's just kinda ... what happened.

And while this isn't everybody out there (of course not), it's a large chunk of the porno-spending pie. Or, as Giorgio put it:

You don’t understand the scale of this.

I know he was referencing something different - but it applies here.

OF didn't just come along and grab a slice of the porno market pie.

It essentially became the pie.

But not all OF girls have a regular income!

Also for some very attractive OF girls (I dont even know because I dont pay for OF and never will do) I would pay 40$ for DAPbreakin'. Maybe I should make a poll about it?

Mining OF in a manner of getting the lesser popular/income earning girl's to do AV/PB sounds great in theory. But that's theory. There are lots of hurdles to overcome. Some that are intrinsically super hard to dismantle.

The promise of OF to the "beautiful girl" is that she'll be able to earn tons of money for doing very little. Like - the OF performers are a lot smarter than you showed yourself to be in that quote dap-addict (really not trying to be a dick here - I'm really not - but the basicness of this next observation will put this all into the proper context).

The girl who doesn't want to perform professional porn - and instead maybe show a little bit of side tiddy for a few thousand every month - actually values her own ladder rungs the way they should be valued. Each one of them should be a sacred barrier that would take a tank to get through. If you look at some of the most popular and monetarily rich performers out there - they have actually shown and done very little - and continue to pull in insane amounts of profits.

Have you ever heard of Tessa Fowler? Go look her up. In the decade plus she's been producing porn (well before OF), she's never inserted a dildo into herself even once. She's got beyond millions of dollars at this point, I believe, if not tens of millions. She's essentially set.

This is the framework by which these girl's enter OF - with the dreams of becoming the next Tessa Fowler. And guarding those ladder rungs becomes the highest of importance. What used to be "BBC DAP" is essentially "showing a full nipple" for these girls. And, you know what? There's enough of them earning top dollar that they kept the dream alive for everyone else underneath them who isn't earning that kind of cash. "One day," they'll say.

So, "convincing these girl's to do AV/PB" is not going to be easy. In fact, it's going to be incredibly stupid difficult.

You can branch into girl's who are doing similar content to come over and sell their stuff here - like Jewelz Blu or Bae York - but they are using AV/PB and not the other way around.

It's not that it's impossible - but you have to remember - time is money. And how do you start? Where do you search?

I believe it is fully possible - but the OF dream is still "too alive" in most girl's heads - and the contract structure of what exists at AV/PB, from my guesstimates, would be an immediate turn-off for these girls (who aren't interested in one time contracts where they don't receive dividends on the sales themselves).

Maybe a studio will be formed that will figure it out. But, you have to remember, AV/PB isn't dealing from a position of strength here. AV/PB is the exact kind of porn these girl's didn't want to do. Not just because of all the ladder rung breaks (which you can never unbreak - and go back to the normal stuff again - everyone's going to expect the harder stuff from that point forward) - but because, monetarily, it doesn't make all that much sense.

There is a way to work around that - and find a group of performers who would be comfortable with doing that stuff - and who would be beautiful enough to bring in the money. It is, theoretically, possible at least. But, again ... we have to remember ...

OF isn't a slice of the porno pie anymore.

OF is the pie at this point.

[dap-addict]

Have you ever heard of Tessa Fowler?
(...)
You can branch into girl's who are doing similar content to come over and sell their stuff here - like Jewelz Blu or Bae York - but they are using AV/PB and not the other way around.

It's not that it's impossible - but you have to remember - time is money. And how do you start? Where do you search?

I believe it is fully possible - but the OF dream is still "too alive" in most girl's heads - and the contract structure of what exists at AV/PB, from my guesstimates, would be an immediate turn-off for these girls (who aren't interested in one time contracts where they don't receive dividends on the sales themselves).
(...)
OF isn't a slice of the porno pie anymore.

OF is the pie at this point.

This is the sales profit sharing GIO was testing with AdV!
Why did it fail, Giorgio?

[netzerkaiser]

What? Is the site not profitable? Does anyone know since when? What will happen to the back catalogue if the site 'closes'?

Thanks!

[xxx]

Low sales? Costs doesn't worth it? Not enough girls? Too many ugly gay guys in the website main page ?
Why? Why is it over? Don't tell me that is because 0nIyf4ans cuz' that's not true.

One day we may close the forum entirely and those uninformed doomsday threads will be part of the reason why.

In reality Pornbox has *always* been growing. Studios come and go, for various reasons unrelated to the platform.

With that said we have more work to do on the UI. We have released a big update yesterday that should help a lot users who are into trans, gay, lesbo/girls and not the rest. And we have more major updates coming.

[xxx]

Let me add that we have been so generous with studios releasing exclusive content here that we are doing better financially when they leave. So you are misguided and misinformed by people who have no clue.

[xxx]

And more on the topic of studios' fate: in my opinion very few of them are able to recognize beauty and who the best models are. "Studios" are also terrible at picking good thumbnails. On top of it they do not understand that releasing "filler" scenes slowly kills them as it kills the interest of their viewers and dilutes the visibility of their few good scenes. And when things get worse as a result of bad choices they try to go into harder content and that makes it even harder to get good models, and they spiral down.

[RedBaron]

And more on the topic of studios' fate: in my opinion very few of them are able to recognize beauty and who the best models are. "Studios" are also terrible at picking good thumbnails. On top of it they do not understand that releasing "filler" scenes slowly kills them as it kills the interest of their viewers and dilutes the visibility of their few good scenes. And when things get worse as a result of bad choices they try to go into harder content and that makes it even harder to get good models, and they spiral down.

I totally agree with you. But why is there no "coaching" for the studio owners to improve their marketing?
IMO a lot of custumers give the studios helpful information how make their scenes better. But most of them don't listen, e.g. AGO at the beginning was talking to his customers. Now he does not and is producing the same boring stuff (creampies, which are not swallowed) again and again.

[NEScaffe96]

Now he does not and is producing the same boring stuff (creampies, which are not swallowed) again and again.

Studio AGO simply do what they do, it's their style, like it or not. Lot worse thing is when someone many times and especially multiple times with the same girl, put title "Cum in Mouth, Swallow" and actually it corresponds to the truth, same as the color of "box" (in Pornbox Forum) in top left corner, is black. And color of every emoji here on forum is green.

[bake0213]

Low sales? Costs doesn't worth it? Not enough girls? Too many ugly gay guys in the website main page ?
Why? Why is it over? Don't tell me that is because 0nIyf4ans cuz' that's not true.

One day we may close the forum entirely and those uninformed doomsday threads will be part of the reason why.

In reality Pornbox has *always* been growing. Studios come and go, for various reasons unrelated to the platform.

With that said we have more work to do on the UI. We have released a big update yesterday that should help a lot users who are into trans, gay, lesbo/girls and not the rest. And we have more major updates coming.

First, thanks for weighing in. Second, with all due respect, I don't think the regular users care as much about whether your site is doing well as much as they care whether the content is doing well. Yes, studios come and go, but if popular studios leave and all you are left with is re-warmed amateur content, people aren't going to be happy. It's great that you are doing well with the site, but people want to see hot women having hardcore sex. Thanks for listening.

[hyapet]

And more on the topic of studios' fate: in my opinion very few of them are able to recognize beauty and who the best models are. "Studios" are also terrible at picking good thumbnails.

Glad somebody said it.

Makes you wonder why though, right?

I mean, that's like somebody who's in the car selling business, both not knowing what cars are popular/good or how to advertise them. Like ... how did they get the job/join the business then, right?

One day we may close the forum entirely and those uninformed doomsday threads will be part of the reason why.

That would be an unwise move.

I mean - I get 100% what you're saying. In fact - I've said the same thing here multiple times in the past. Stuff like, "It's a no-brainer that the main-site doesn't link to a discussion board that has a (very small) subset of trolls who just shit on everything the main-site does."

Usually in all-caps and size 144 font.

But! But! The stable of incredible directors and performers the overall business has had in the past (and present still) has built a loyal following of people who care passionately about your product. While that might seem like, yeah, who cares, it ultimately can provide a good bell-weather as to how your product is doing overall.

When you separate all the folks who pretend their specific preference is everybody's preference, you are still left with a relatively (huge) population of people who can comment insightfully on everything from camera work to the models that are being contracted to the impact certain studios and their work have had on the overall legacy of the organization as a whole. There are also plenty of industry insiders who just share ideas/thoughts/knowledge - and you get a hub of information that, while it might be hard to pin-point exactly what it's good for when it's here, it'll be one of those things you'll definitely be missing when it's gone.

AV/PB and, really, Legalporno (which brought so many of us here) felt always like something more than "a cash grab for porn." Honestly - all porn is a cash grab - that's not even a bad thing. It's a business after all. People want porn - people pay cash - pretty simple. But, the operation here always felt like people who loved porn producing porn for those who love it. More than any other site. It felt like an artists ode to what top-notch porn should really be about.

The fact that it had these forums was a testament to that. It was like, "Hey, all you aficionado's, come hang out here, your home." It's like you recognized and enjoyed the art you produced and felt like it was worthy of a place to actually discuss it and give it the praise (or opposite) it deserved.

There's something genuine about that. In a day and age where the Internet pretty much ... might not even be real for many people anymore ... there's something about a late 90's/early 00's forum board for all the legit porn connoisseurs to hang around in that's like the gentleman's club of yore at the end of a small Italian town's street.

It's something that, once it's gone, it's never coming back. And that feeling - that moment in time - is worth something more than to just be tossed because it's inconvenient, or because it may provide a hassle now and again.

And the people, these people who are here, carry the history of this place with them as well. Which could be absolutely crucial when new producers/new productions move in, and want to know both how their product is being viewed, how it's being compared to this site's history, and what people are reminded/inspired of when they see it.

There is a lot of knowledge and a lot of history within these walls. More than that - there's a lot of character.

Maybe the desire is to just be "another porno site." But, once you cross that line ...

You can't really come back.

[dap-addict]

One day we may close the forum entirely and those uninformed doomsday threads will be part of the reason why.

That would be an unwise move.
(...)
But! But! The stable of incredible directors and performers the overall business has had in the past (and present still) has built a loyal following of people who care passionately about your product. While that might seem like, yeah, who cares, it ultimately can provide a good bell-weather as to how your product is doing overall.
(...)
Maybe the desire is to just be "another porno site." But, once you cross that line ...

You can't really come back.

+ 1
I edited this to a size also xxx will read.

[jerrybb]

There are no problems financially here
Regular models sells good and make good money for herself and for the producer.

We don’t have new models, the reason is that on OF a big slice of dudes pay 20$ for a 15 minutes video of a girls alone without anal and 50-100$/minute for a custom video. This bring every model with a bit of brain to make several thousand dollars/month without to struggle. Good models to make dozen of thousand/month.
You don’t understand the scale of this.

On the other side YOU DO NOT pay 40$ for a dap with pee or 30 for a dp, so a producer here cant offer 6000$ to a model for a dap pee and 4000 for a dp, but just a normal payout that is not interesting if you already have a good regular income

This is how it is.

Thanks for explanation Giorgio.

[dap-addict]

One day we may close the forum entirely and those uninformed doomsday threads will be part of the reason why.

Wouldnt it be a bitter option to delete such posts or threads, but still keep your loyal and passionate customers and supporters exactly with such a forum other competitors dont run anymore?
Dont all brands set on loyalty?
Why destroy it?

You'd be better put a more visible link to forum on landing page again!

[nrop1_nnn]

Lol I have to agree with the "People request the same models over and over again doing the same thing"

[Kumozora]

Sineplex / LP is a unique phenomenon in porn history.
It has shot all the possible multi-girl anal scenarios through 2000-2016, with at least 100 different groups of models for each same setup.
Human brains have neither the need of a infinite number of genres of fetishes, nor a limitless erotic imagination ability. "ass to other mouth" may had been the last effective general fetish created, only because ancient people rarely fuck 2 girls at a time.
Males brains are just designed to keep asking for more new girls rather than new action.
Sineplex / LP had full filled both with its extraordinary gonzo assembly line and the gorgeous amount of Russian models. The GB Sliders Pmao TS RMG HC etc from old DVDs. are still shining, but free to be watched illegally anywhere on the internet now.

Too many good old scenes, and the lack of Russian models since the 2014 Russo-Ukrainian War, make it very hard to shoot a similar well-selling scene Nowadays. It is not a good idea to ask for new scenes from GIO, if you have not yet check all the sineplex Classic, SOS, CZ, GIO<1000, XfreaX series. They are old, but new to you.

Maybe all the necessary porn has been already been created, and all we need in this period. is a complete and smart porn database, the introductions, captions and pmv.

[TYRESE]

Gay porn on the page causes people to not check out the page much anymore.

[Pboxer88]

O-fans definitely pulls a lot of simps and guys looking to part with $ for the GF experience. I finding it boring AF personally, but understand it's huge.

Also, despite not being popular on this site, the answer is VR people. There's a lot of fake news about headsets not being used. They're not being used for gaming and stupid Meta Quest Apps, but they're being used for porn. Over 83% of VR headset users watched VR porn at least once before; 67% of users bought VR headsets exclusively for adult content. 51 million units have been sold, double from over 2 years ago. Those obviously aren't cellphone numbers, but it's substantial. And even if it's "only" 51 million, again, most of them are being used for VR porn. Quest 3 was a big step up in visual quality.

Long Term Solution: Giorgio/Angelo/Erika Korti/etc. should use a VR180 cam side by side with his flat camera. The latter will please 98% of the people on this site who are not into VR, and the former will bring in NEW fans, demand and money.

Midterm solution: Literally hire someone to do what I'm doing with spatial video/stereoscopic 3D for trailers on the main videos and add these as optional download files. My thread is below. I can literally never watch flat porn again now. Yes, VR180 cams would be amazing, but in the meantime the AI and 3D software is getting better every year and you can use this to convert current 2d videos to something much more visceral and engaging. Granted, part of the appeal for me is I convert FULL videos for my collection, but won't share those for obvious legal reasons.

(My thread)
FAN PROJECT: Pornbox 3D/spatial video! 5+ Samples enclosed!

viewtopic.php?f=96&t=89311
https://forum.pornbox.com/viewtopic.php?f=96&t=89311

Nuria Millan: "Porn friends don't let porn friends watch flat porn anymore, unless they have no other options and have to."

[kuaheyden513]

Gay porn on the page causes people to not check out the page much anymore.

[kuaheyden513]

Nothing disgust m but when you come to see pretty hot girls being assfucked and in the last three years you see the 40% of new videos on the feed are hairy fags fucking. Well, its weird. Or those gay videos are saving the site?

[Gape_Connoisseur]

All things change. Inevitably there are ups and downs. It's about survival of the most adaptable and to make the most of opportunities.

[kuaheyden513]

All things change. Inevitably there are ups and downs. It's about survival of the most adaptable and to make the most of opportunities.

[annmsklr5]

Low sales? Costs doesn't worth it? Not enough girls? Too many ugly gay guys in the website main page ?
Why? Why is it over? Don't tell me that is because 0nIyf4ans cuz' that's not true.

One day we may close the forum entirely and those uninformed doomsday threads will be part of the reason why.

In reality Pornbox has *always* been growing. Studios come and go, for various reasons unrelated to the platform.

With that said we have more work to do on the UI. We have released a big update yesterday that should help a lot users who are into trans, gay, lesbo/girls and not the rest. And we have more major updates coming.

So may I ask, xxx, what's the mid-term goal with Analvids? What can we expect, will the site continue?

[House MD]

There are no problems financially here
Regular models sells good and make good money for herself and for the producer.

We don’t have new models, the reason is that on OF a big slice of dudes pay 20$ for a 15 minutes video of a girls alone without anal and 50-100$/minute for a custom video. This bring every model with a bit of brain to make several thousand dollars/month without to struggle. Good models to make dozen of thousand/month.
You don’t understand the scale of this.

On the other side YOU DO NOT pay 40$ for a dap with pee or 30 for a dp, so a producer here cant offer 6000$ to a model for a dap pee and 4000 for a dp, but just a normal payout that is not interesting if you already have a good regular income

This is how it is.

Thanks for explanation Giorgio.

It's nothing to do with money and then goes about explaining the return on investment... on a business niche which... well does not even remotely relates to his own market
Speaking of a headless chicken crashing a plane in the mountains

[annmsklr5]

Giorgio said in another thread:

In average
With a hot girl that does anal and DP maybe I can make good money on short term, but with the amount of money she will start soon to get as Content Creator, she wont be available to perform anymore pretty soon.
A less hot girl will continue to perform for other longer time and more willing to experiment with DAP and Pee. A model performing DAP and Pee doesnt sell because she looks hot only, she sells because the niches she explores are highly selling compering to anal and DP.

THIS is the way for AVLP to survive over OF and the likes.

[annmsklr5]

I mean don't tell me that vast majority of porn consumers (even in 10 years from now) want to consume OF like soft porn. I just don't believe that.
And the same goes to performers. I believe there are and will still be girls that seek to try and do more extreme nasty stuff like AVLP is known for.

[obelix.courageux]

I have said in the past that I would like to see LP/AV try different genres. When I have suggested in the past that I think LP / AV should add a studio that specializes in lesbian kink, I was told they were not interested in doing lezdom. They seem to think lesbian kink can only be lezdom. I really wish they would stop thinking that everything has to be about domination.

[obelix.courageux]

I have said in the past that I would like to see LP/AV try different genres. When I have suggested in the past that I think LP / AV should add a studio that specializes in lesbian kink, I was told they were not interested in doing lezdom. They seem to think lesbian kink can only be lezdom. I really wish they would stop thinking that everything has to be about domination.

I forgot to add an example of lesbian kink that I would love to see. There's a fetish with growing popularity where a woman will insert food into their asshole (e.g. grapes, cherries, bananas, just about anything) and then poop it back out. It's really hot when the food is pooped into the mouth of another person, who then eats it. A twist is if the woman also pees into the eater's mouth. I think this would fit in well with the type of porn that LP / AV offers, while adding some variety.

[abaco73]

I've already said the reasons a million times, these are the 3 main reasons:

1) The site has become a site where the only thing that matters is piss, vomit and prolapses. Women and sex don't matter, we can see this all the time, where if a new scene comes out and it doesn't have piss, vomit and prolapses people complain about it.

2) The strange taste that the users of the site have: they always prefer mature and not so pretty women to young and beautiful girls. It's like they have a broken sense of good taste.

3) They ask for a million times for scenes of the same model doing the same thing over and over and over again. It's an incredible thing, it seems that they don't get tired of seeing the same thing constantly.

So, you think the site is dying because it does what users want?
Strange point...
By the way, I share your tastes (don't like piss, nor vomit, I prefer young girls and I never buy more than a couple of scenes with the same actress.
Still, a site will die if they don't follow the wishes of average user, not if it does.
Your points (even if I share them) are nonsense.

[jjwhite1985]

So, you think the site is dying because it does what users want?
Strange point...
By the way, I share your tastes (don't like piss, nor vomit, I prefer young girls and I never buy more than a couple of scenes with the same actress.
Still, a site will die if they don't follow the wishes of average user, not if it does.
Your points (even if I share them) are nonsense.

I mean, of course a porn site will die under those conditions - there aren't an infinite number of girls, so if everyone followed that premise then the income would just dry up.