Mariupal

[poldijk]

Your explanation is subject to debate because we could invade a lot of countries with this logic : china (think about ouïghours or Tibetan), Iran, North corea, Palestine…..

Palestine, I mean Israel invading Palestine since 70years

[drevokocur66]

Zelensmonkey is the Coward actually, poor people are suffering because of that jock, he's the cause of war, it wouldn't have happened if he stayed neutral. Now he's giving guns to Civilians & is hiding in his hole with his nazi azzove battalion. They won't fight they surrender, 1000 Nazis surrendered last week, poor Civilians fight to death. Zelensmonkey will be captured by Russians soon.

Indeed, but perhaps it happen they stay neutral anyway?

They chose NATO and definitely cause it happen though. Also Ukraine is destroyed nation. Economy is ruined. Last autumn, Ukraine signed big deal Petroleum near Azov sea.

The Russians take that too now.

In the end, the only thing Putin is taking is a giant cock in his ass.

[poldijk]

In the end, the only thing Putin is taking is a giant cock in his ass.

I like this short way to remind us we are on PB forum after all those geopolitic discussion

[antiochethereal]

Think of it from the rest of Europe's perspective (while keeping in mind I am on Ukraine's side). We are just all pouring money into the Ukraine now, because of Russia; and because every other country wants to keep the war far away from home... right? After the COVID outbreak was ebbing out this absolute genious decides to invade Ukraine, and now the REST of us all over the world have to pay more for energy and goods, because we can't very well sit on our asses and do nothing. No matter which way you look at it Putin is a fucking moron. If you think otherwise you're either indoctrinated or dumb as shit, or a combination. Even if he gets Ukraine, so fucking what? he bombed it all to shit and threw billions of all our money away in the process not to mention countless soldiers and civilians on both sides. He probably doesn't even have the money to keep up the occupation, let alone rebuild the country. He effectively just bankrupts Russia and Ukraine, and makes the rest of us poorer while he gets to be in a history book right beside Hitler, the Kim-Jong's, Mao and Stalin; CONGRATU-fucking-LATIONS! and then on the other side of the fence we have fucking actors like Trump and Zelenskij; while I like Zelenskij he is still an actor and keeps egging the rest of us, baiting us into WW3 - I mean, his country is already fucked right? so why don't we all just join in. Trump wooing Putin also. This world is fucked for sure; no matter the outcome of this.

[Iddaoeeok]

Confusing times for fascists, white supremacists and anti-Semites!

Mr Vagabundo very much proving my point.

[vvvv84335]

Confusing times for fascists, white supremacists and anti-Semites!

Mr Vagabundo very much proving my point.

All vagabundo cares about is white dicks rubbing together in a woman. They say "Dear reader, look at how everyone else besides me is an LGBT cuckboi" yet they ask for DVP and DAP in their posts xD

DAP/DVP/DP is bisexual content, yet they pretend it's heterosexual content. They've even blocked me since they know they can't refute this xD

Now they're trying to stir up political disagreements as well... What a sad, sad person. Why are they even on this site? xD

[YumYum74]

Now they're trying to stir up political disagreements as well... What a sad, sad person. Why are they even on this site? xD

The first sentence is the answer to your question.

[vvvv84335]

Now they're trying to stir up political disagreements as well... What a sad, sad person. Why are they even on this site? xD

The first sentence is the answer to your question.

Yea I guess you're right. Those who are bitter/angry behave like this, they have a need to get a rise out of others and can't face who they really are as people.

[bdsmpretty]

If you were truly wise, you would have made allies with Ukraine nationalists, NOT murder them. Please consider that and tell to Russian friends before it's too late.

Putin is not going to spare Nazis, even if they surrender, thats his decision. Poor Nazis...

The Ukrainian Nationalists are openly white supermacist and anti-semites (they hate Roma too, for that matter).
They may not display the more obviously toxic branding and symbolism of the notorious NeoNazi Avoz/PravySektor/C14 etc, but it's 99% the same thing, all wrapped in a Ukrainain flag instead of the swastika.

At heart, they are (by a large majority) Banderite fascists and racists who regard all Russians (and even Russian speaking Ukrainians) as unter-mensch and subhumans who don't deserve to live. Check out their terrorizing of the people of the Donbass over the past eight years for indisputable proof of that.
And, just as the Nazis did before them (hence why Stepan Bander aligned with them during WW2), they draw a blood and cultural line between what they consider the civlized white-skinned West and the barbarian swarthy Slav-Asian East.
And they place that 'us and them' line between Ukraine and Russia.

As for those holed up in Azovstal, well they have had a hundered chances to lay down their arms and surrender.

Many have, and have not been tortured or shot (while Ukrainian military accounts have posted footage and photos on multiple occasions of them doing so to Russian POWs) but taken into scrupulously legal POW custody in line with Geneva Conventions.
They will be debriefed, checked against the Russian's extensive records of those Ukrainians wanted for war crimes and acts of terrorism against the people of Donbass.
If they are cleared (and the majority of non NeoNazi Ukrainian Military will) they will be returned to their families once the conflict has concluded. This is the standard practice for captured military personalle in any conflict.

As for those who have refused every chance to surrender, well it's pretty clear by now that they want to die as martyrs, so it looks like they will be seiged to death.
Putin has said he considers them dealt with (ie. without food, water, supplies, etc, they get to starve to death). Why (he argues reasonably) risk any more Russian soliders lives to fight to them to the death, when they have chosen to starve?

When Putin said Denazisfication, Demilitarization, and Ukraine as a neutral non-aligned country (and by extention, a new European Security framework more stable than the current).
This in contrast with the current aims of US Imperialism (via the toxic military and sanctions juggernaut that is NATO) seeking to divide and destablise Europe (as it previously has the Middle East, North Africa and much of South America in recent times) to make everyone dependent on them - in perpetuity - for security and resources. Vassals not countries.

As for outcomes (spolier alert) Ukaine loses. It's offical.

Donetsk and Lugansk have already declared independence and had that has been legally recognised by Russia (it was their request to Russia for military assistance - as independent states - that brought Russia into this, in line with UN law).
Had Zelensky observed his Minsk commitments, they could have been Ukrainain territory with special status to recognise and protect the largely Russian populations in those regions. But he blew it. So they are independent states now and lost to Ukraine for good.

Crimea went in 2014, after a free and fair referendum in which 90+% voted to rejoin Russia.

It looks likely that Odessa will have a similar referendum and go the same way. The decade long terror campaign by the NeoNazi Paramilitaries on the people of that territory (with Zelensky/Ukraine govt blessing) guarantees that outcome.

The issue that creates is that Odessa would then be cut off, which would make it vulnerable to past violence against them reviving as soon as Russia leaves.
So it is not unthinkable (extremely likely many wise commentators say) that Russia will offer referenda to all those regions along the southern coast between Odessa and Kherson (including Mariupol).
That preserves a land bridge from Crimea to the mainland, which makes sense. And Ukraine is once again landlocked.

A look at the map of the 2004 election, shows that the likely outcome of those referenda would give that result and Ukraine would lose access to its coast.

ukraine vote 2004 election - Copy (2).png (399.75 KiB) Viewed 5341 times

This would (more or less) recreate the pre-Soviet scale and form of Ukraine, as pre 1917 it was a fraction of what it has become.
Though strangely Ukrainian Nationalists who constantly demand De-Communization (destruction of Soviet era institutions and monuments) never seem to want to talk about De-Communization when it comes to returning Soviet-gifted territory.

Pepe Escobar (always a must-read for Eurasian geopolitics) has explored that possible outcome here. Worth your time.
https://thecradle.co/Article/columns/8480

But essentially... Ukraine loses.

And all noise contrary to that obvious fact is just NATO govts and people refusing to accept their role in 'grooming' the Ukrainian govt and people to believe that if Ukraine picked a fight with Russia, NATO would start World War Three in order to save them.
There is a lot of guilt and a lot of denial in 'the NATO room' about that right now (and as for the guilt, so there should be), hence the retreat into ongoing fantasy and delusion about an imminient Ukrainian victory. It's a mass psychosis.

ukraine win psychosis - Copy.jpg (37.45 KiB) Viewed 5341 times

But Ukraine is not blameless either. Many bought into that fantasy so quickly and readily because Banderite Ukrainian nationalism (widespread, not just in NeoNazi pockets) makes Ukrainians who subscribe to it feel they are a superior 'race apart' (white, western, civilised-cultured) within Europe/Eurasia.
So viewed in that context, the idea that NATO genuinely would risk World War Three just to save them (from the 'barbarian' Slavs and Asians) makes a grim kind of sense.

Once upon a time there was a diplomatic solution...

[bdsmpretty]

*Incomplete sentence. Corrected version below.

"When Putin said 'De-Nazification, De-Militarization, and Ukraine as a neutral non-aligned country (and by extension, a new European Security framework more stable than the current)' were his objectives for this intervention, he meant it."

[drevokocur66]

You think Ukraine is winning this war?

Putin already lost.

[xxxVIPERxxx]

I hope the Ukrainian forces defend the steelworks factory in this city for as long as possible.
Good luck to all the brave people out there defending freedom!

[Iddaoeeok]

What a spectacle this thread has become, you have Vagabundo who is conflicted about criticizing his fellow fascists and so doesn't know whether he's coming or going, he generally thinks of neo-Nazis as the good guys. Meanwhile, overweening "leftist" (lol) windbag, tldrpretty, continues churning out his Kremlin-approved blather in the illusion anyone has the time, energy or interest to read it beyond the first paragraph.

[poldijk]

What a spectacle this thread has become, you have Vagabundo who is conflicted about criticizing his fellow fascists and so doesn't know whether he's coming or going, he generally thinks of neo-Nazis as the good guys. Meanwhile, overweening "leftist" (lol) windbag, tldrpretty, continues churning out his Kremlin-approved blather in the illusion anyone has the time, energy or interest to read it beyond the first paragraph.

I don't see that in this thread. Excepting people talking about coward, monkey or dick in the ass, I think Vagabundo & Bdsmpretty (I catch your TLDR/too long didn't read) are sharing their opposite POV with respect and explanation.

I think that's the purpose of Netzerkaiser by opening this thread.

if you read carefully, Vagabundo is not supporting nazi, when replying to my post about AZOV, he is talking about Ukraine Nationalist, which is respectable, when you imagine how this nation has suffered in the past (but Nationalism can be soiled by nazi, it happens unfortunately in a lot of countries starting by mine) :

They chose the losing side, were destroyed. No one was good. One big deadly snake (Germans) was killed by bigger snakes.

TLDRpretty , I know we can discuss about our disagreements calmly and constructively, your logic looks like the one of the media Russian Today therefore, I’m eager to get your answers.....since RT has been banned from France

You will, of course, anticipate the predictable reactions of the French/Democratic/no war guy, but I wish you to clarify some points

When Putin said Denazisfication, Demilitarization, and Ukraine as a neutral non-aligned country (and by extention, a new European Security framework more stable than the current).
This in contrast with the current aims of US Imperialism

“more stable than the current”, I have to disagree, because of Poutine, the European security is not very stable today. I do understand the fear of US imperialism and you know how I think this country has blood on his hands but…even if Ukraine joined NATO, I can’t understand Russian people saying “they will invade our beautiful country”.

It does not make sense, invading Russia….France, Germany, UK will never accept that, why would NATO countries invade Russia?
Ok USA did a dirty invasion of Irak but for me, it’s ok if Ukraine is joining NATO and European Union.
I feel like it is just Poutine who sees his geographic influence melting like an ice-cream. But Ukraine is a sovereign country, with an historical Russian connection, but sovereign.
With Russia, we should do business, vacation travel, student exchange, discover this beautiful country and opera (and sex, loooot of sex )
and get ride of this Russia/USA opposition, this stupid cold war should go to the trash once and for all.

Donetsk and Lugansk have already declared independence and had that has been legally recognised by Russia (it was their request to Russia for military assistance - as independent states - that brought Russia into this, in line with UN law).

To legally recognise independence, Ukraine should have officially accepted it. Then, Europe (and even USA) would have no choice but recognizing Donetsk and Lugansk as republic.
We have a complex issue in France with Corsica (you can google it). Some people want to be independent since years. They used to do terrorist attack, politic murders…
My government sent Police, independentists using weapons are now in Gail (the other are fighting via politic), Corsica belongs to France, end of discussion.
I can’t believe our German friend could recognize the independence of Corsica (or a region closed to germany with french separatists willing to get closed to Germany) if France disagrees.

Crimea went in 2014, after a free and fair referendum in which 90+% voted to rejoin Russia.

We, in Western Europe, have a big question about the “free and fair referendum”.
Could someone finally and officially tell us who are those guys? As far as my brain is concerned, an army without flag smells bad.

It is Russians? Is it Wagner? why are they hidding their face? For sure it is not Ukraine

if my country was invaded by a "no flag army" and my national army unable to kich their ass out of my earth, I would understand people showing this kind of pictures (be careful, the picture is prohibited under 18 )

crimea.jpg (15.54 KiB) Viewed 5253 times

Crimea’s parliament depends on Ukraine’s parliament (exactly like Corsica’s parliament depends on France’s parliament) or tell me if I’m wrong.
Same logic as the Donbass or Corsica, if Crimea wants to be attached to Russia, they need the green light of the country who owns the sovereign border, Ukraine. Even if 90% (very sexy result by the way) of Crimea people are Russian friendly

So it is not unthinkable (extremely likely many wise commentators say) that Russia will offer referenda to all those regions along the southern coast between Odessa and Kherson (including Mariupol).
That preserves a land bridge from Crimea to the mainland, which makes sense

Even if I’m a bit chocked, I feel lucky to have the chance to discuss with you.
Russia could organize a referendum on Ukraine earth? Everybody understood the land bridge dream Poutine is trying to build.
Zelensky said “every inch of Ukrain earth stolen by Russia will come back to us, whatever the time it will take”. As a citizen, whatever the country, I can’t disagree, it is an invasion.
Every inch of French earth stolen by German Nazi has been given back, and they had to pay huge amount of money to repair everything they destroyed in my country.

Though strangely Ukrainian Nationalists who constantly demand De-Communization (destruction of Soviet era institutions and monuments) never seem to want to talk about De-Communization when it comes to returning Soviet-gifted territory.

I catch your logic but it sounds…illogic

We all know Crimea is a git from the soviet, it’s done. If we had to rebuilt the borders by cancelling all territories gift given here and there around the world, for sure 3rd world war will starts!

I understand Russians are angry about this soviet gift but as we say, giving is giving and taking back is stealing

Since Crimea is part of Ukraine, officially recognize by the United Nations, I can understand Ukraine people saying “thank you for the Crimea during last century but now, we are in 2022, we want to enter in European Union”

[Iddaoeeok]

I see this many weeks ago blocked Idda is attacking me in the thread by name, to truth he is a bigot who hates Whites and Europeans. He is the type who hates White/European men so much that he fetishizes White/European women. Reminder is like the rapist Harvey Weinstein, who loved to rape women not of his own ethnicity. . These sociopathic personalities try to attach themselves to the Left, to the Right, any strong governments or organizations. They NEVER remember wrongdoing they have done, never forget wrongdoing done to them. Sometimes, they are caught and thrown out. This happened in Soviet era, which is why there is undying hatred of Russia and slavs in media.

I probably shouldn't bother responding to this as this guy has some kind of bizarre paranoia/ persecution complex going whereby anyone who confronts him is, by definition, anti-white, anti-European or a homosexual (latent or otherwise), or all three, like he is somehow the embodiment of white European masculinity. I understand that it''s probably necessary for maintaining his mental equilibrium but it's still weird. Also he seems to be implying that I am not white or European, so he's employing a kind of dysfunctional ideation that is bordering on the delusional. I'm wondering, in that case, if I'm not white and European who that guy I see in the bathroom mirror every morning is? LOL.

Anyway, I didn't attack him, as such, all I did was point out that as a fascist and an anti-Semite, neither of which he's denied being because it's true, these must be confusing times in terms of picking sides in this conflict. Which he promptly demonstrated by saying Ukranian neo-Nazis were deserving of our support and sympathy not our opprobrium.

[vvvv84335]

I see this many weeks ago blocked Idda is attacking me in the thread by name, to truth he is a bigot who hates Whites and Europeans. He is the type who hates White/European men so much that he fetishizes White/European women. Reminder is like the rapist Harvey Weinstein, who loved to rape women not of his own ethnicity. . These sociopathic personalities try to attach themselves to the Left, to the Right, any strong governments or organizations. They NEVER remember wrongdoing they have done, never forget wrongdoing done to them. Sometimes, they are caught and thrown out. This happened in Soviet era, which is why there is undying hatred of Russia and slavs in media.

I probably shouldn't bother responding to this as this guy has some kind of bizarre paranoia/ persecution complex going whereby anyone who confronts him is, by definition, anti-white, anti-European or a homosexual (latent or otherwise), or all three, like he is somehow the embodiment of white European masculinity. I understand that it''s probably necessary for maintaining his mental equilibrium but it's still weird. Also he seems to be implying that I am not white or European, so he's employing a kind of dysfunctional ideation that is bordering on the delusional. I'm wondering, in that case, if I'm not white and European who that guy I see in the bathroom mirror every morning is? LOL.

Anyway, I didn't attack him, as such, all I did was point out that as a fascist and an anti-Semite, neither of which he's denied being because it's true, these must be confusing times in terms of picking sides in this conflict. Which he promptly demonstrated by saying Ukranian neo-Nazis were deserving of our support and sympathy not our opprobrium.

Don't worry, nobody takes this clown seriously. At this point we're just waiting to see what they'll say next. They're not able to come to terms with their own homo/bi-sexuality and that bothers them. When confronted with questions/statements that they can't answer they'll just block you. "Dear reader, look at how these leftist cuckboi LGBT attack and hate the white European" Yea we must really hate the white European since we are on a site where most of the porn is depicting white Europeans fucking other white Europeans. Sure you have some other ethnicities, but most nobody cares as long as the action is hot.

It's like watching a football match where some of the players are black and they happen to excel - in his mind if we cheer for them when they score a goal we are hating white Europeans and also picture ourselves as being fucked by them. A psychiatrist would be rich if they had him as a patient, they'd never have to have another client.

[vvvv84335]

What a spectacle this thread has become, you have Vagabundo who is conflicted about criticizing his fellow fascists and so doesn't know whether he's coming or going, he generally thinks of neo-Nazis as the good guys. Meanwhile, overweening "leftist" (lol) windbag, tldrpretty, continues churning out his Kremlin-approved blather in the illusion anyone has the time, energy or interest to read it beyond the first paragraph.

I don't see that in this thread. Excepting people talking about coward, monkey or dick in the ass, I think Vagabundo & Bdsmpretty (I catch your TLDR/too long didn't read) are sharing their opposite POV with respect and explanation.

I think that's the purpose of Netzerkaiser by opening this thread.

if you read carefully, Vagabundo is not supporting nazi, when replying to my post about AZOV, he is talking about Ukraine Nationalist, which is respectable, when you imagine how this nation has suffered in the past (but Nationalism can be soiled by nazi, it happens unfortunately in a lot of countries starting by mine) :

They chose the losing side, were destroyed. No one was good. One big deadly snake (Germans) was killed by bigger snakes.

TLDRpretty , I know we can discuss about our disagreements calmly and constructively, your logic looks like the one of the media Russian Today therefore, I’m eager to get your answers.....since RT has been banned from France

You will, of course, anticipate the predictable reactions of the French/Democratic/no war guy, but I wish you to clarify some points

When Putin said Denazisfication, Demilitarization, and Ukraine as a neutral non-aligned country (and by extention, a new European Security framework more stable than the current).
This in contrast with the current aims of US Imperialism

“more stable than the current”, I have to disagree, because of Poutine, the European security is not very stable today. I do understand the fear of US imperialism and you know how I think this country has blood on his hands but…even if Ukraine joined NATO, I can’t understand Russian people saying “they will invade our beautiful country”.

It does not make sense, invading Russia….France, Germany, UK will never accept that, why would NATO countries invade Russia?
Ok USA did a dirty invasion of Irak but for me, it’s ok if Ukraine is joining NATO and European Union.
I feel like it is just Poutine who sees his geographic influence melting like an ice-cream. But Ukraine is a sovereign country, with an historical Russian connection, but sovereign.
With Russia, we should do business, vacation travel, student exchange, discover this beautiful country and opera (and sex, loooot of sex )
and get ride of this Russia/USA opposition, this stupid cold war should go to the trash once and for all.

Donetsk and Lugansk have already declared independence and had that has been legally recognised by Russia (it was their request to Russia for military assistance - as independent states - that brought Russia into this, in line with UN law).

To legally recognise independence, Ukraine should have officially accepted it. Then, Europe (and even USA) would have no choice but recognizing Donetsk and Lugansk as republic.
We have a complex issue in France with Corsica (you can google it). Some people want to be independent since years. They used to do terrorist attack, politic murders…
My government sent Police, independentists using weapons are now in Gail (the other are fighting via politic), Corsica belongs to France, end of discussion.
I can’t believe our German friend could recognize the independence of Corsica (or a region closed to germany with french separatists willing to get closed to Germany) if France disagrees.

Crimea went in 2014, after a free and fair referendum in which 90+% voted to rejoin Russia.

We, in Western Europe, have a big question about the “free and fair referendum”.
Could someone finally and officially tell us who are those guys? As far as my brain is concerned, an army without flag smells bad.

It is Russians? Is it Wagner? why are they hidding their face? For sure it is not Ukraine

no flag.jpg

if my country was invaded by a "no flag army" and my national army unable to kich their ass out of my earth, I would understand people showing this kind of pictures (be careful, the picture is prohibited under 18 )

crimea.jpg

Crimea’s parliament depends on Ukraine’s parliament (exactly like Corsica’s parliament depends on France’s parliament) or tell me if I’m wrong.
Same logic as the Donbass or Corsica, if Crimea wants to be attached to Russia, they need the green light of the country who owns the sovereign border, Ukraine. Even if 90% (very sexy result by the way) of Crimea people are Russian friendly

So it is not unthinkable (extremely likely many wise commentators say) that Russia will offer referenda to all those regions along the southern coast between Odessa and Kherson (including Mariupol).
That preserves a land bridge from Crimea to the mainland, which makes sense

Even if I’m a bit chocked, I feel lucky to have the chance to discuss with you.
Russia could organize a referendum on Ukraine earth? Everybody understood the land bridge dream Poutine is trying to build.
Zelensky said “every inch of Ukrain earth stolen by Russia will come back to us, whatever the time it will take”. As a citizen, whatever the country, I can’t disagree, it is an invasion.
Every inch of French earth stolen by German Nazi has been given back, and they had to pay huge amount of money to repair everything they destroyed in my country.

Though strangely Ukrainian Nationalists who constantly demand De-Communization (destruction of Soviet era institutions and monuments) never seem to want to talk about De-Communization when it comes to returning Soviet-gifted territory.

I catch your logic but it sounds…illogic

We all know Crimea is a git from the soviet, it’s done. If we had to rebuilt the borders by cancelling all territories gift given here and there around the world, for sure 3rd world war will starts!

I understand Russians are angry about this soviet gift but as we say, giving is giving and taking back is stealing

Since Crimea is part of Ukraine, officially recognize by the United Nations, I can understand Ukraine people saying “thank you for the Crimea during last century but now, we are in 2022, we want to enter in European Union”

poldijk: sorry if I've asked this before, but who is that girl on your profile picture?

[Iddaoeeok]

tldrpretty will be along any minute with two dozen paragraphs on instances of cannibalism in the Donbas regions, complete with maps, pie charts and Venn diagrams that conclusively prove that Ukranians drink the blood of Russian children and grind their bones to make bread.

[poldijk]

poldijk: sorry if I've asked this before, but who is that girl on your profile picture?

Hi vvv84335, no, it is the first time someone asks me

it is Rebecca slovak, my porn love before Khali Noire

I talk about here :
viewtopic.php?f=96&t=26097&p=600061&hilit=top+10#p600061

I detailed her movies here :
viewtopic.php?f=96&t=20659&start=160

and the casting video with Pierre Woodman on Analvids:
https://www.analvids.com/watch/86210/re ... e_audition

have fun

[stewpidaz]

tldrpretty hahahahaha

[vvvv84335]

poldijk: sorry if I've asked this before, but who is that girl on your profile picture?

Hi vvv84335, no, it is the first time someone asks me

it is Rebecca slovak, my porn love before Khali Noire

I talk about here :
viewtopic.php?f=96&t=26097&p=600061&hilit=top+10#p600061

I detailed her movies here :
viewtopic.php?f=96&t=20659&start=160

and the casting video with Pierre Woodman on Analvids:
https://www.analvids.com/watch/86210/re ... e_audition

have fun

Thank you very much!

[poldijk]

bdsmpretty ,

I would be pleased to get your answers

[netzerkaiser]

Remarkably the Russians have agreed to evacuate Mariupal wounded heroes,be they Azov or Marines... they're brave men.

Maybe this could lead to a respectful end-of-war where everyones able to save face?

Lets hope so.

[netzerkaiser]

Why did Putin allow these guys safe passage?

I'm baffled.

I'm glad he did -I thought, the world thought, they were doomed. I know some of them must be bad eggs as many people have pointed out here, with questionable beliefs & I'm sure, CV's. Certainly Putin tarnished an entire nation with the ethos of some these boys.

This makes situation all the more baffling to me.

[netzerkaiser]

I was right to smell a rat:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ukraine-ru ... -complete/

Now they've 'surrendered'.

Dirty, dirty ploy. Fom noble evacuation to surrender.

It seemed to good to be true.

[YumYum74]

Are you surprised? Of course they’ll spin this.

[netzerkaiser]

Are you surprised? Of course they’ll spin this.

And the Ukrainian negotiators didn't get this? Theres gotta be some double-crossing here surely, or these 256 would've stayed put? They were fucked anyway. The agressor is just losing everyones respect by the minute.

[bdsmpretty]

Are you surprised? Of course they’ll spin this.

And the Ukrainian negotiators didn't get this? Theres gotta be some double-crossing here surely, or these 256 would've stayed put? They were fucked anyway. The agressor is just losing everyones respect by the minute.

My post from nearly a month ago (above in full). Read it. You clearly don't know where to get reliable info, so it should help.

The Ukrainian Nationalists are openly white supermacist and anti-semites (they hate Roma too, for that matter).
They may not display the more obviously toxic branding and symbolism of the notorious NeoNazi Avoz/PravySektor/C14 etc, but it's 99% the same thing, all wrapped in a Ukrainain flag instead of the swastika.

At heart, they are (by a large majority) Banderite fascists and racists who regard all Russians (and even Russian speaking Ukrainians) as unter-mensch and subhumans who don't deserve to live. Check out their terrorizing of the people of the Donbass over the past eight years for indisputable proof of that.
And, just as the Nazis did before them (hence why Stepan Bander aligned with them during WW2), they draw a blood and cultural line between what they consider the civlized white-skinned West and the barbarian swarthy Slav-Asian East.
And they place that 'us and them' line between Ukraine and Russia.

As for those holed up in Azovstal, well they have had a hundered chances to lay down their arms and surrender.

Many have, and have not been tortured or shot (while Ukrainian military accounts have posted footage and photos on multiple occasions of them doing so to Russian POWs) but taken into scrupulously legal POW custody in line with Geneva Conventions.
They will be debriefed, checked against the Russian's extensive records of those Ukrainians wanted for war crimes and acts of terrorism against the people of Donbass.
If they are cleared (and the majority of non NeoNazi Ukrainian Military will) they will be returned to their families once the conflict has concluded. This is the standard practice for captured military personalle in any conflict.

As for those who have refused every chance to surrender, well it's pretty clear by now that they want to die as martyrs, so it looks like they will be seiged to death.
Putin has said he considers them dealt with (ie. without food, water, supplies, etc, they get to starve to death). Why (he argues reasonably) risk any more Russian soliders lives to fight to them to the death, when they have chosen to starve?

"When Putin said 'De-Nazification, De-Militarization, and Ukraine as a neutral non-aligned country (and by extension, a new European Security framework more stable than the current) were his objectives for this intervention, he meant it.
This in contrast with the current aims of US Imperialism (via the toxic military and sanctions juggernaut that is NATO) seeking to divide and destablise Europe (as it previously has the Middle East, North Africa and much of South America in recent times) to make everyone dependent on them - in perpetuity - for security and resources. Vassals not countries.

As for outcomes (spolier alert) Ukaine loses. It's offical.

...

Once upon a time there was a diplomatic solution...

As for 'smelling a rat/double-cross/etc'.
No, they surrendered. Your media spun it as 'Evacuated' to save face. You believed it.

Fresh update (1 hour ago) re the mass surrender at Azovstahl:
'Exclusive footage of how surrendering( evacuiating) of #Azov members from #Azovstal looked today in #Mariupol.'
https://nitter.net/Youblacksoul/status/ ... 9665100801

And here's a bonus with more details about the golden boys you are currently cheering on:
'Thread: A few weeks ago Zelensky released prisoners with combat experience from jails. What they didn't tell you is that some of these prisoners are the infamous Tornado Battalion imprisoned for raping minors in front of their parents.'
https://nitter.net/Youblacksoul/status/ ... 4648098817

A curious thing.
In Germany autumn 1944, everyone you met would say they had always been a member of the Nazi Party.
While in Germany autumn 1945, everyone you met would say they had never been a member of the Nazi Party.

History is full of reports like that, and full of people like that. Don't be one.

[netzerkaiser]

In Germany autumn 1944, everyone you met would say they had always been a member of the Nazi Party.
While in Germany autumn 1945, everyone you met would say they had never been a member of the Nazi Party.

I read a book called "German boy" once.

https://www.amazon.com/German-Boy-Wolfg ... 0767908244

The best Nazi's became the best commies became the best free-marketeers.

Scumbag human nature... apart from few who are noble.

You mistake me. You make a treaty of sorts - you stand by it. Or its just like USA vs native Americans.

You're wrong BSM... & you dishonour people who've gone through in past 82 days more than you maybe ever did or will.

[avanfurwet]

... You make a treaty of sorts - you stand by it ...

Maybe someone should explain that to our Boris. Except that would be like playing chess with a pigeon.

Hope for the best for the poor heroic bastards extracted from Azovstal. Have zero confidence in any statements from the Russian regime, but just maybe they will exchange the Ukrainian boys for some Russian boys and both sides can still pretend it's a great victory in their propaganda war.

[poldijk]

History is full of reports like that, and full of people like that. Don't be one.

that's the reason why I wish to have your feedback about my post above

a lot of people are against the war and it is interesting to have your POV. I used to watch RussianToday before banned, to have their version of the story.

I have no idea about why you don't answer my post about NATO invading Russia, Donetsk and Lugansk's independence and crimea gift, did I offended you?

at least, can you please highlight our brain about Crimea's referundum, who are those guys (no flag army) taking care of the "free and fair referundum"?

file.jpg (57.66 KiB) Viewed 4438 times

[aleste81212]

Marine Lepen is dangerous.
Even if I don’t like communitarianism and of course terrorism attack (a lot of blood has been shed in France), I can’t believe she wants to ban the veil for Muslims and the yarmulke for Jews.
There will be a civil war in my country if she is elected.

Do you still standby these comments ?