Camera Work

[Dominator]

I wanted to bring up this topic formally on the board because some users have been making comments about the camera work and how it can be improved.

First, for the moderators and the guys running the company, perhaps you guys can explain the exact process you use. Specifically, I would like to know if the guy operating the camera is the director, or if you have a separate person dedicated to the camera work. Also, how many different directors are currently shooting scenes for LP these days?

I ask these questions because I feel that the camera work is in need of much improvement. It is possibly the single major aspect of LP today this is not up to par. You guys have great models and performers, great action and the right emphasis as far as fetishes and niches are concerned. However, let's have an honest discussion about this. If you compare the LP camera work in general to other major Euro porn studios, such as 21Sextury, Evil Angel (though not Adriano, his shots are terrible), DDF, Dorcel, Private, etc., etc... these studios all have far superior camera work.

What needs to be improved? My most compelling thought is that there is an overall lack of direction and execution. I should know because I've purchased the majority of scenes that have been released in the last few months. Lately, there have been too many scenes where the penetration is being blocked by a performers head or their body. The performers are obstructing too many shots. It is the director's responsibility to prevent this from occurring. Also, the editor might want to cut out those segments where this occurred. This almost NEVER occurs in the clips from the studios I mentioned. A good example of this would be the latest Timea/Henessey scene where the angles and shots were subpar for everything after the initial Kreme segment. I felt that the scene started off amazingly, but then got much worse because of poor execution by the guys behind the camera. Also, in the 5 on 5 scene, after Mike cums in Blanche's asshole, the other girls licking it out were fully obstructing us from seeing what they were doing. All we saw was the back of their heads. In addition, the shots are often framed without any proper thought. You have ATOGM occurring where the girl sucking the dick is barely in the shot. You have shots where half the frame has NOTHING in it, just empty space, with the performers' bodies being cut off unnecessarily. Other times, the dude's body will be fully in the shot, but the woman's body is not. Needless to say, this is definitely not what the fans want to see. Another issue is that there seems to be prolonged periods where the picture goes blurry, and it often takes too long to refocus. This also never occurs with other studios, and honestly, should be cut from the scene because it is actually somewhat hard on your eyes when it happens like that. Lastly, as exemplified by the latest Nikita Belluci 3 on 1 scene, the camera man was SO SLOW to react to the action. I mean, his response time was just so sluggish, he missed important aspects of the scene. A good example of this was when she was being showered with piss and Mike tells her to tilt her head back and open her mouth so they could piss in it, but the camera man panned down to her body and totally missed an awesome shot.

So, my suggestions for improving this are:
-Get guys who are actually skilled with a video camera. Not everyone can do this well. Perhaps a reevaluation of your camera men is in order.
-Be more mindful of the fact that good porn is not just about good fucking. You guys have pretty much mastered this aspect. Your performers are mostly TOP notch and do a fantastic job fucking, generally speaking. However, more emphasis and thought should be put into set up and direction during the scene. I do enjoy that the material is not laden with cuts and edits, but sometimes you need to stop the action and make sure the shots are set up so that the scene capitalizes on the great action. No action should be blocked by a performer who is out of place. Likewise, the angles at which the performers are being presented to the camera is a crucial aspect of how enjoyable the scene is.
-Study how other major successful directors shoot their scenes and take note. Good examples to follow IMO would be Rocco, Jay Sin, Christoph Clark, and Buttman. They center the shots so that the right aspects are being focused on. It's not important to get the whole guy or guys in the shot. It is important, however, to get as much of the girls in it, and to make sure that you react quickly to the action so things are not missed.
-Just keep shooting. Leave the editing to the editors. There have been numerous examples of the camera guy switching focus to something else in the scene such as a different performer right in the middle of some super hot action. As a result, we miss out on some great stuff.

In conclusion, I have tried to not be overly critical, but something needs to be done to improve the camera work in general. I'm a big fan and loyal customer of LP, and that is why I would like to see things get better. I will say that I'm still very pleased overall with the material you guys are releasing. It's EASILY some of the best porn ever made. But I do believe that when the camera work is finally mastered, the material will hands down be the best in the industry.

Please share your thoughts and continue this discussion! Perhaps you disagree. That's fine, too.

[Bradpyth]

I don't think it's a problem with their cameraman.

You compare studios that shoot mostly totally predefined scènes: bj, pussy 2 positions, anal 2 positions, cumshot and that's it. They edit it in order to have an easy-to-sell product, 20 min long and that's it. They gonna take 5 hours to do so, edit the whole stuff, and you get a stereotyped product. I think particularly for Dorcel, Private, Brazzers, 21sx, etc... Good job but not big risk or originallity.
I think in a particular scene, Blanche and Lola Taylor near a swimming pool with 2 guys. You can imagine a crazy scene with those 2 girls who are famous at LP for sluttyness. And, guess what... this scene from Brazzers is horribly boring, even if technically perfect. I would prefer to see the same group at LP, even with some natural imperfections.

Than LP shoots totally different things, sex and positions are much more rich and complex, I think they try not to edit out interesting things even if it's not technically perfect (then with other studios, if it's blurry, it's deleted, even if the action is interesting, nobody matters, they just need 20 min of commercial content and that's it).
I think it's much more interesting to have a passionnate and original product from LP than a boring product from 21sx.

Jay Sin and in a smaller scale Clark shoot interesting things, but again, it's totally less risky than what sineplex shots, Jason mostly shoots 2 girls, so angles are easy, he just plays with his camera and the girls on girl action. When comes a boy, position are much more classical than a crazy 2 on 2 from LP. And you see he needs some footage length, but will not push it to natural action contrary to LP.

And Rocco... wtf! Rocco is passionnate and original, but FULL of technical mistakes!!!!!!!!!!!! OK sineplex can miss some action and things like that, but imo Rocco sucks with lighting in most of the occasions! I don't think LP would make such huge mistake with light than to shoot in outdoors with the sun in the wrong side of the camera! And even those technical issues, his scenes are much more fun than a boring 21sx or stuff like that!

That's just to tell, if you want similar product than 21sx, dogfart, DDF etc, you'll loose all the most interesting part of LP, spontaneous slutty action cannot be totally shot in a predefined way!


And last thing, about blurry seconds: I think it's not specifical to LP. When you hold a camera with automatic focus, sometimes the cam loose the focus and "pumps" few seconds. If light conditions are good it doesnt takes so long to refocus. I think all studios have the same issue, but they delete it when editing. So what do you prefer: to loose a particulary good action because first seconds of it are lil" blurry, or to get it nevertheless?

[Dominator]

To Bradpyth, there's truth to what you're saying, but you're kind of missing the point. It isn't about what they shoot, it's how they shoot it. I already said a few times, content-wise LP is putting out great stuff. I don't think you have to sacrifice creativity, originality and doing edgy stuff for good, consistent camera work. And The2ndBiggestPirate is right, in 2010-2011, tons of scenes were released with better camera work and no moments of prolonged blurriness. Perhaps some of the issues I spoke of are more a problem of directing and editing, but I stick to the fact that lately there are too many instances of sloppy camera work for any professional company with this kind of talent. It's not in every scene, but it's in quite a few.

[PC_82]

To Bradpyth, there's truth to what you're saying, but you're kind of missing the point. It isn't about what they shoot, it's how they shoot it. I already said a few times, content-wise LP is putting out great stuff. I don't think you have to sacrifice creativity, originality and doing edgy stuff for good, consistent camera work. And The2ndBiggestPirate is right, in 2010-2011, tons of scenes were released with better camera work and no moments of prolonged blurriness. Perhaps some of the issues I spoke of are more a problem of directing and editing, but I stick to the fact that lately there are too many instances of sloppy camera work for any professional company with this kind of talent. It's not in every scene, but it's in quite a few.

have to remember the camera man is the director also making sure they follow the rythm. problem is he is watching everything and has to control all actors, all angles, and watch for the faces of the actresses. have you ever seen stupid faces besides when vinny is around laughing or acting bored?


yeah the action is well controlled but its really fucking hard. especially like when girls shitting like crazy and you have a DP that cant do anything but cut cut cut and never any gapes or anything else. its either cancel or improvise...


editors are new and they are scared to leave blood or poo even if its small. they already fixed some scenes that are not continuous with the camera work. so they are going to try to use another effect instead of hard cuts. edits are messing up the flow for sure...

[PC_82]

I wanted to bring up this topic formally on the board because some users have been making comments about the camera work and how it can be improved.

First, for the moderators and the guys running the company, perhaps you guys can explain the exact process you use. Specifically, I would like to know if the guy operating the camera is the director, or if you have a separate person dedicated to the camera work. Also, how many different directors are currently shooting scenes for LP these days?

I ask these questions because I feel that the camera work is in need of much improvement. It is possibly the single major aspect of LP today this is not up to par. You guys have great models and performers, great action and the right emphasis as far as fetishes and niches are concerned. However, let's have an honest discussion about this. If you compare the LP camera work in general to other major Euro porn studios, such as 21Sextury, Evil Angel (though not Adriano, his shots are terrible), DDF, Dorcel, Private, etc., etc... these studios all have far superior camera work.

What needs to be improved? My most compelling thought is that there is an overall lack of direction and execution. I should know because I've purchased the majority of scenes that have been released in the last few months. Lately, there have been too many scenes where the penetration is being blocked by a performers head or their body. The performers are obstructing too many shots. It is the director's responsibility to prevent this from occurring. Also, the editor might want to cut out those segments where this occurred. This almost NEVER occurs in the clips from the studios I mentioned. A good example of this would be the latest Timea/Henessey scene where the angles and shots were subpar for everything after the initial Kreme segment. I felt that the scene started off amazingly, but then got much worse because of poor execution by the guys behind the camera. Also, in the 5 on 5 scene, after Mike cums in Blanche's asshole, the other girls licking it out were fully obstructing us from seeing what they were doing. All we saw was the back of their heads. In addition, the shots are often framed without any proper thought. You have ATOGM occurring where the girl sucking the dick is barely in the shot. You have shots where half the frame has NOTHING in it, just empty space, with the performers' bodies being cut off unnecessarily. Other times, the dude's body will be fully in the shot, but the woman's body is not. Needless to say, this is definitely not what the fans want to see. Another issue is that there seems to be prolonged periods where the picture goes blurry, and it often takes too long to refocus. This also never occurs with other studios, and honestly, should be cut from the scene because it is actually somewhat hard on your eyes when it happens like that. Lastly, as exemplified by the latest Nikita Belluci 3 on 1 scene, the camera man was SO SLOW to react to the action. I mean, his response time was just so sluggish, he missed important aspects of the scene. A good example of this was when she was being showered with piss and Mike tells her to tilt her head back and open her mouth so they could piss in it, but the camera man panned down to her body and totally missed an awesome shot.

So, my suggestions for improving this are:
-Get guys who are actually skilled with a video camera. Not everyone can do this well. Perhaps a reevaluation of your camera men is in order.
-Be more mindful of the fact that good porn is not just about good fucking. You guys have pretty much mastered this aspect. Your performers are mostly TOP notch and do a fantastic job fucking, generally speaking. However, more emphasis and thought should be put into set up and direction during the scene. I do enjoy that the material is not laden with cuts and edits, but sometimes you need to stop the action and make sure the shots are set up so that the scene capitalizes on the great action. No action should be blocked by a performer who is out of place. Likewise, the angles at which the performers are being presented to the camera is a crucial aspect of how enjoyable the scene is.
-Study how other major successful directors shoot their scenes and take note. Good examples to follow IMO would be Rocco, Jay Sin, Christoph Clark, and Buttman. They center the shots so that the right aspects are being focused on. It's not important to get the whole guy or guys in the shot. It is important, however, to get as much of the girls in it, and to make sure that you react quickly to the action so things are not missed.
-Just keep shooting. Leave the editing to the editors. There have been numerous examples of the camera guy switching focus to something else in the scene such as a different performer right in the middle of some super hot action. As a result, we miss out on some great stuff.

In conclusion, I have tried to not be overly critical, but something needs to be done to improve the camera work in general. I'm a big fan and loyal customer of LP, and that is why I would like to see things get better. I will say that I'm still very pleased overall with the material you guys are releasing. It's EASILY some of the best porn ever made. But I do believe that when the camera work is finally mastered, the material will hands down be the best in the industry.

Please share your thoughts and continue this discussion! Perhaps you disagree. That's fine, too.

can you screenshot some of the latest stuff your pissed about please so i can show them WTF

[Tastes Like Ass]

First, thanks for bringing this up. It's a very important and often overlooked topic. Before I respond to what's already been said here, I want to give some of my general thoughts about camerawork in general (not just here at LP).

I first started watching lots of porn about 15 years ago, and back then, most of the camerawork was absolutely terrible. It's improved a lot since then, and is probably better now than it's ever been, but it's still fairly common to see otherwise good scenes that are basically ruined by bad camerawork. In my opinion, this usually happens because of one (or both) of the following mistakes:

1. Too many closeups. This was probably the biggest problem back 10-15 years ago. Sometimes you just get these almost endless closeups of the penetration, while other times they go back and forth between closeups of the penetration and closeups of the girl's face, but the result is the same. You're forced to look at what the camera guy wants you to see, whether it's what you want to see or not. Of course, having too many wide shots is bad, too (except in group scenes, where wide shots allow you to see multiple girls getting fucked at the same time, which is really the main point of that kind of scene to begin with). But what you normally want is a lot of medium shots, where you can clearly see the penetration, but you can also see the rest of the girl, especially her face. It's so much hotter to be able to see the look on the girl's face, as she reacts to the things that are being done to her. So, these medium shots should be the bread and butter shots, with an occasional closeup or wide shot, to provide some context.

2. Hyperactive camerawork. This was a big problem about 5-10 years ago, particularly with certain guys, like Raul Christian, Mike John, and Jules Jordan (although Jordan has improved in recent years). Basically, this is when the camera is almost constantly moving, usually very rapidly, and almost never stays with the same angle for more than about 5 seconds. It gives the scene a very chaotic feel, like watching a music video, and makes it almost impossible to concentrate on the action. It's fine to move the camera around until you find a good angle (preferably one of the medium shots, where you can see everything), but once you find that great angle, you need to stick with it for at least 30 seconds, in order to give the viewer a chance to really enjoy it, rather than immediately rushing off to find the next shot.

Now, as far as the camerawork here at LP, I think it is generally pretty good, compared to most of the other top companies, even though obviously, some scenes are shot better than others. Also, I haven't seen many of the very recent scenes, since I have been conserving my tickets, at least until something is done about the ridiculously expensive reload situation. So, it's possible that the scenes from the last month or so have been a lot worse than the ones that preceded them. But I have watched the vast majority of the stuff that came out in November and December, as well as some of the stuff from January and February, and most of it has been pretty well shot, although again, there's always room for improvement.

As for the specific complaints, I do agree that there are some problems with sloppy framing and with blurriness, but I disagree that the proper cure is more editing. I personally despise scenes that are too heavily edited (such as many of the ones at 21Sextury), because it destroys the natural rhythm of the scene and makes it seem very fake, as if you were watching a very long trailer, or a highlight reel of some sort. Finally, as for the guys that you suggest they emulate, I agree with some, but not others. I can't really say much about Buttman, as I rarely watch his stuff, but what little I have seen tends to have way too many long closeups for my taste. As for Rocco, some of his scenes are well shot, but many of them suffer from the kind of hyperactive camerawork I was discussing earlier (and the picture often tends to be very grainy, as if it was shot on a cell phone, but that's a different matter). However, I do agree that Christoph Clark and especially Jay Sin do a really nice job. In fact, Jay's camerawork is about the one aspect of his movies that hasn't really gone downhill over the years, so if you're going to pick someone to emulate, he would be a pretty good choice.

Again, though, thanks for bringing this up, as the quality of the cinematography is something that really should be discussed on a regular basis, just like the quality of the girls and the quality of the sex. Overall, I think LP is doing a pretty solid job in all 3 areas, but I do agree that there's probably a bit more room for improvement with regard to the cinematography than with regard to the girls or the sex.

[Pissing]

I think there's nothing wrong with the camera work.
Like BradPyth said: It is simple to make a perfect scene, just edit away all the parts where there is something not 100% perfect..... And you end up having a boring Vivid porno.

I really appreciate it when a scene has been done in 1 shot, 30 minutes, no cuts, just like real life.

[Sir Noel]

editors are new and they are scared to leave blood or poo even if its small. they already fixed some scenes that are not continuous with the camera work. so they are going to try to use another effect instead of hard cuts. edits are messing up the flow for sure...

Leave it in its: it will sell.

One of the longest running and most popular threads on adultdvdtalk is dedicated to accidental dirty anal and a2m. Sure, I think the vast majority of consumers don't want to see scat scenes and deliberately induced mess, but such moments can seriously gain you new members and interest from elsewhere, editing them out is nothing short of madness imo.

[tgcfc26]

I gotta agree with plum here, just leave the little accidents in. I'm not talking crazy shitting everywhere but the odd bit of dirty anal or ass juice here and there isn't so bad. If the scene gets a little dirty just leave a disclaimer on the purchase page, that way nobody can complain.

The moments of blurriness were the camera loses focus are a bit frustrating but I would rather that than a complete edit. The editors have already ruined some scenes in the past. In the Cayenne Klein double stuffed trailer, there is a part where Vinny is slamming her pussy so hard juices start flying everywhere, even hits the camera which is about 4 feet away. That is a real turn on to see, did it make the final cut ? NO !! The fucking editors decided to take it out, probably because of a little hitting the camera.

PC, when you say "they are going to try and use another effect", please tell them not to do that blurring censor shit they did in a recent 3 on 1, It just takes you out of the moment and at that point all I'm thinking is what did I miss.

[tgcfc26]

I'm talking about a different type of blurring there Pirate You're highlighting a moment where the camera has lost focus, I was mentioning an instance where the whole shot was in focus but they censored (or blurred out) a specific small part of it. The sort of thing you see a lot of in Japanese porn.

[Bradpyth]

When you're really close to the action, you may have some issue loosing the focus point, more of you lack a little of light (it's not the case here). Because the processor doesn't know where to focus exactly when you've narrower depth of field.
I think also the skin tone is also a possible cause of loosing the autofocus, for example a total smooth and clear skin don't help with the focus issue, as to try to focus on a perfect white surface.

It's a matter of technology and not of the cameraman himself.

When it's happen on a Dorcel set, they just shoot it again, and in mainstream cinema also.

So the question is if you want all this crazy shit the most natural and spontaneous possible, or if you want all the crazy acts are premedited and repetited actions... For me it would be a poor substitute and would equal to Brazzers or consors.

Just my opinion....

[Dominator]

can you screenshot some of the latest stuff your pissed about please so i can show them WTF

First off, let me restate that I am not pissed off about anything. And I'm certainly not pissed off about porn. I hope my post did not give that impression. I'm merely someone with enough viewing experience and access to enough material for a long enough time to know what is good, and what isn't so good. So, there is no anger and no demands are being made. I'm just offering my feedback and suggestions as a paying customer who feels that the set up, camera angles, and actual filming of the material could be better executed. It's as simple as that.

As for screenshots, it would be my pleasure.

Here are a couple from the 5 on 5. Clearly, the action is being obstructed by the performers. Proper direction will improve this.



From the Timea/Henessy Kreme scene... Timea's head and Tony's cock are out of the shot. Part of Henessy's lovely leg is cut out.


Another one from that scene.. Some seriously sloppy execution here. Their positions are all messed up. Timea's leg is obstructing her body and face, as well as part of Henessy's body.


From the most recent Triple Stacked with Sandra Luberc... Check out all of the empty space up top, and the penetration is cut off. Very sloppy.


Another one from that scene. Why is this shot in the final cut? It's nothing but empty space with zero stroke-worthy action.


Here is that missed opportunity to film two guys pissing in Nikita's wide-open mouth. Her head is back and her tongue is out, but we didn't get to see it properly. Just totally the wrong angle to take in this situation.


Those are the most recent examples I can think of right now. I will definitely admit that there are some scenes in which there are no issues with the camerawork or direction at all. However, in too many scenes these days, there is 1) lack of oversight and input by the director to position the performers properly to set up the shots, and 2) poor execution of the actual filming. Like I said, it's not something just anyone can do well. It takes some skill and experience to shoot porn, especially when it's a 2 on 2 (or more). That definitely poses challenges. However, if someone doesn't have the experience to know, for example, to film Nikita's open mouth while her head is tilted back from a higher angle so we can see the action, then that person probably shouldn't be doing this job. You guys are a professional studio and should have more professional camerawork.

[Bradpyth]

I agree on above pics, but it's like 0,5% of the whole scene.

And believe me, when you watch at rushes from Dorcel or other studios, you see similar stupidities. But in that case they edit it out, or play again the scheduled action.

I agree sometimes we think "Why the fuck don't you take a lower angle" or stuff like this. But, the job is very well done, at, let's say, 99% so I wouldn't say the cameraman sucks.

And it's not always possible to anticipate what people will do. OK they are directed, but sometimes you see the director/cameraman expects the girl to lick the ass, or directly tells her, and then she sucks the cock. If you're on close ups, you might loose it, even if you're jay sin yourself... Maybe that's why Jay's movies looks like anal circus and LP or Rocco looks like a big fun!

[Tastes Like Ass]

And it's not always possible to anticipate what people will do. OK they are directed, but sometimes you see the director/cameraman expects the girl to lick the ass, or directly tells her, and then she sucks the cock. If you're on close ups, you might loose it, even if you're jay sin yourself...

Just another reason why there shouldn't be many closeups. In fact, if you watch Jay Sin, and other good camera guys, you will notice that they rarely use closeups. They use mostly medium shots, with some wide shots to provide context, and only an occasional closeup here and there. That's one of the main reasons why they almost never miss anything important. Guys that shoot lots of closeups have to try to move the camera rapidly every time something new happens, and they inevitably miss a lot of stuff.

[PC_82]

can you screenshot some of the latest stuff your pissed about please so i can show them WTF

First off, let me restate that I am not pissed off about anything. And I'm certainly not pissed off about porn. I hope my post did not give that impression. I'm merely someone with enough viewing experience and access to enough material for a long enough time to know what is good, and what isn't so good. So, there is no anger and no demands are being made. I'm just offering my feedback and suggestions as a paying customer who feels that the set up, camera angles, and actual filming of the material could be better executed. It's as simple as that.

As for screenshots, it would be my pleasure.

Here are a couple from the 5 on 5. Clearly, the action is being obstructed by the performers. Proper direction will improve this.



From the Timea/Henessy Kreme scene... Timea's head and Tony's cock are out of the shot. Part of Henessy's lovely leg is cut out.


Another one from that scene.. Some seriously sloppy execution here. Their positions are all messed up. Timea's leg is obstructing her body and face, as well as part of Henessy's body.


From the most recent Triple Stacked with Sandra Luberc... Check out all of the empty space up top, and the penetration is cut off. Very sloppy.


Another one from that scene. Why is this shot in the final cut? It's nothing but empty space with zero stroke-worthy action.


Here is that missed opportunity to film two guys pissing in Nikita's wide-open mouth. Her head is back and her tongue is out, but we didn't get to see it properly. Just totally the wrong angle to take in this situation.


Those are the most recent examples I can think of right now. I will definitely admit that there are some scenes in which there are no issues with the camerawork or direction at all. However, in too many scenes these days, there is 1) lack of oversight and input by the director to position the performers properly to set up the shots, and 2) poor execution of the actual filming. Like I said, it's not something just anyone can do well. It takes some skill and experience to shoot porn, especially when it's a 2 on 2 (or more). That definitely poses challenges. However, if someone doesn't have the experience to know, for example, to film Nikita's open mouth while her head is tilted back from a higher angle so we can see the action, then that person probably shouldn't be doing this job. You guys are a professional studio and should have more professional camerawork.

first 2 pics are from 2nd camera man.. its ok for him to do this as he is not the main camera
the other fotos are from the set up because it was being set up as you can see mike going full speed and director tell him to slow down for the transition
the other one with hennesy again transition it was for a few seconds until the director knew she could handle the doouble anal.. there your capturing like transitions where they are speaking to actors
i would not worry about it there is plenty of good camera in all the scenes .. the editors are leaving too much transition where the director is setting something up..

this is more about editing than camera work. so editors understand that some guys dont like this. but over all the scene does not flow good with points like this in... the double anal scene captured was well done except a few points of the set up when hennesy blocked timeas face 1 or 2 times . they redid it again so its clean shots

last image with nikita was about her nodding that no she will not take pee from tony and made a bad face saying no so had to move to the pee moving down her body until her face again was ok to shoot from talking in the action... should of just redone it and made them drink more water and retake it.

[porninquisitor]

I just wanted to say that to shoot perfectly a gangbang scene (with sometimes more than one girl to focus on) we have (as cameramen) to be at least three.
Gangbang scenes are the most difficult to shoot.

I remember a promoter that tried to fix up cams on actors foreheads to have multi pov input streams. It was a terrible result but the experience was fun.

[PC_82]

director told me just to post this:


scenes are not easy when piss is moving near his feet.
then one girl is not going to take pee from one guy and keeps saying no.. if you look at this sequence you can see she is back up to no take anymore pee in mouth.. and then tony appears.

it makes sense for the camera work but should of cut out what you think is bad camera work.

PLENTY OF OPEN MOUTH PISSING … what you seen is 14 sec of her backing off YOUR "BAD CAMERAWORK" is when tony is coming into the picture

[PC_82]

director told me just to post this:


scenes are not easy when piss is moving near his feet.
then one girl is not going to take pee from one guy and keeps saying no.. if you look at this sequence you can see she is back up to no take anymore pee in mouth.. and then tony appears.

it makes sense for the camera work but should of cut out what you think is bad camera work.

HERE SHE WAS DONE NO MORE PEE IN MOUTH!

[PC_82]

director told me just to post this:


scenes are not easy when piss is moving near his feet.
then one girl is not going to take pee from one guy and keeps saying no.. if you look at this sequence you can see she is back up to no take anymore pee in mouth.. and then tony appears.

it makes sense for the camera work but should of cut out what you think is bad camera work.

HERE CAMERA AGAIN READJUSTED AFTER CLEAN FLOOR AND THEN TONY CAME IN FOR BODY SHOT

[Dominator]

Thanks for the responses, PC_82. It does seem that a lot of these issues could be improved with better editing. I think that in these "transitional" situations where the performers are repositioning themselves, unless they pull it off smoothly and start to fuck in the new position with the right camera angles, then these moments should be cut out. Of course, I think overall, it's better to have less cuts and let the action flow naturally. It's just some things, like heads blocking the action for more than a couple of seconds and wasted shots with excessive empty space, that should be cut.

[PC_82]

Thanks for the responses, PC_82. It does seem that a lot of these issues could be improved with better editing. I think that in these "transitional" situations where the performers are repositioning themselves, unless they pull it off smoothly and start to fuck in the new position with the right camera angles, then these moments should be cut out. Of course, I think overall, it's better to have less cuts and let the action flow naturally. It's just some things, like heads blocking the action for more than a couple of seconds and wasted shots with excessive empty space, that should be cut.

yeah editors now are going to:

take this stupid camera moments out that are not necessary
keep small spills nothing chunky but expected moments of anal positions nothing that is completely gross like a hamburger coming out

[Dominator]

Thanks for the responses, PC_82. It does seem that a lot of these issues could be improved with better editing. I think that in these "transitional" situations where the performers are repositioning themselves, unless they pull it off smoothly and start to fuck in the new position with the right camera angles, then these moments should be cut out. Of course, I think overall, it's better to have less cuts and let the action flow naturally. It's just some things, like heads blocking the action for more than a couple of seconds and wasted shots with excessive empty space, that should be cut.

yeah editors now are going to:

take this stupid camera moments out that are not necessary
keep small spills nothing chunky but expected moments of anal positions nothing that is completely gross like a hamburger coming out

That's great to hear. Thank you. I totally agree about the small spills. A little bit of anal leakage is ok, and it's even better if we see some dirty ATM or ATOGM. There is a great moment in Ass To Other Girl's Mouth scene #231 with Westley, Masha and Janny where Westley is going ATOGM from Masha's ass to Janny's mouth, and while he's going back and forth repeatedly around 19:45, some shit leaks out of Masha's ass. Westley doesn't stop though and keeps feeding Janny his cock, and she is forced to suck his huge, shitty cock many times in a row. She struggles to keep taking it in her mouth, gagging and spitting to get rid of the taste, but like a true submissive slut, she keeps going. It's one of the hottest moments I've ever seen in porno history. If we could potentially have more moments like that, this site would be elevated to an even higher level.

[Sir Noel]

take this stupid camera moments out that are not necessary
keep small spills nothing chunky but expected moments of anal positions nothing that is completely gross like a hamburger coming out

Sounds good, eating my lunch as i type and and these rules pass the 'lunch test' lol!

[SensHK33]

"Taste like ass" post about camera work does hit a lot of things. I've posted a lot about the toys - atm but the same could be applied to the visual aspects with toys and with male performers and acts.

Biggest thing is about the close-ups. I don't mind close-ups, when toys are sliding into that tight ass, but when the toy is sliding out of that ass and then going into her mouth, none of her and the toy(s) even partially should leave the screen. For example:

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This "camera cage" effect is taking away from the toy play or specifically from the toy to mouth act. As you can see, the toy leaves the screen and is cut out. The angling of the camera is even taking away from this part of the scene for the Jessie Volt part with camera so zoomed in. I've notice even these kinds of shots are being used with the B/G scenes were some of the "missing out" of parts are being cut off is missed, due to the standard camera view the director/camera man wants. Directing and timing all part of it.

It would be like the same thing during B/G atm scene, do people want the guy(s) dick to go off screen for a second when she is about to suck it off or do you want it to stay on screen fully. The idea is the same.

These opening scene were good for toy play but room for improvement were the camera should be panned out a couple ticks to make sure the toy stays in scene incase of wild arm swings or quick movement by the girl(s).

Was it was mandated by the owners to have girl always completely in the camera work at maximum? This is not allowing any sudden crazy acts to be captured. If the camera man is not skilled enough he will miss it or it will lose naughtiness aspect of it being too slow to catch up with the action.

As for the editing, for some odd reason again, is there a reason why when Jessie volt is sucking that toy and the scene suddenly does a change? This is probably 1 of the most annoying things, being it with toys or B/G scenes and it almost always happens during a atm shot. If it gets blurry, like everyone posted here to leave it in, that is just a kills the scene everytime.

I still like LP, I just didn't want to see the same crap other sites are doing during their Solo or Lesbo scenes which typically kills the scene.

Brazzers is one of them that with the camera work on HAM kills the scene everytime.
Like NIkki Benz and Summer Brielle scene, the dildo is Nikki's ass and it gets pulled out, the scene was great, she starts sucking it off and the camera just suddenly changes to a full zoom out view. Brutal.

or Devon and Kagney Lynn Karter, she rides a strap on, gets off and sucks on it, and the camera man decides to zoom in on Devon's face. Brutal.

Overall, the 2 opening toy play for the scenes I did post were good but room for improvement. The close-ups of sucking the dildo were good moves and showing a gape and then sliding the toy back into her ass and then straight into her mouth were great from the director/camera man. Just need to make sure the whole toy(s) stays in the camera shot.

Be it ATM, pissing, kreme or whatever, it sounds like people do not want these parts cut and edited. We all want to see the nasty, as for me ATM toys is my nasty cutting it for me is like for everyone else, it sucks.

"follow the dildo"

[utopiaa]

Hope the editors wont go cut happy, what usually tends to happen in situations like these. Nothing is worse that scene too cut and some of the "BTS" stuff that has been left to scenes are pretty nice.

I really think most of the "bad" camera work is also because they seem to film with 2 cameras and try to keep each other out of the picture which sometimes results in weird camera angles, where neither of them is in optimal position.

[Pineapples Studio]

This was not such a glaring problem until recently. I wonder what has changed behind the scenes?

[PC_82]

Hope the editors wont go cut happy, what usually tends to happen in situations like these. Nothing is worse that scene too cut and some of the "BTS" stuff that has been left to scenes are pretty nice.

I really think most of the "bad" camera work is also because they seem to film with 2 cameras and try to keep each other out of the picture which sometimes results in weird camera angles, where neither of them is in optimal position.

this was 2 cameras in 1 scene the party… geez you guys are tripping. there is no other problem except the editors cutting some spills and some little gel coming out… the editors are thinking again like US DVD edits… but they already fixed some of these scenes

[Pineapples Studio]

Come on, you know that's not true. There are obvious problems with the framing of certain shots and with the picture going out of focus for no good reason.

[PC_82]

Come on, you know that's not true. There are obvious problems with the framing of certain shots and with the picture going out of focus for no good reason.

yeah camera man needs new glasses… OMG its something with the camera settings it happens in all productions but they just need to edit out. fast motion causes this stupid thing to happen. its in the edits.. they are fixing some stuff..

and i know all so dont start again with your feitsh gripes cant serve one thing to one guy all the time. there is nothing wrong even with the timecode you mentioned before its all fine… i checked myself.. there is few seconds of this blurry crap for sure…

[Pineapples Studio]

First of all, why are you replying to a PM in a public thread?

Second of all, I am fully aware that you can't serve one thing to one guy all the time. That's not what I asked for in the PM at all and I have no idea why you're bringing it up here. The PM was about the problems with blurry and poorly-framed cinematography. There were literally three sentences about the fetish stuff. You completely missed the point.

Also, the timecode I mentioned does have some hard pounding with Linda Sweet out of frame, you can hear it in the audio and you can even see a little bit of it as the camera pans away from Katie Gold.

[Tastes Like Ass]

Please, don't try to "fix" the problem with more editing. Most porn nowadays is too heavily edited. I miss the genuine feel that you used to get back when most scenes had very few cuts. Today, with all the cuts, most porn has a very artificial feel.

I would much rather you leave in a few blurry moments than to have all these constant cuts.

[Dominator]

^^^ It doesn't really have to be more editing, but rather, it could be just smarter editing.

I agree that taking things too far and over editing the scenes will make things much worse overall. But there's no reason to keep the junk that isn't strokable like poorly executed shots with empty space or these prolonged periods of blurriness.

[Tastes Like Ass]

Well, if it's just to get rid of obviously terrible camera angles and stuff like that, I don't have a problem with it, but of course, that sort of stuff shouldn't be happening very often anyway, if you have a decent cameraman.

The things that really bother me are unnecessary editing (like cutting out every time a little brown liquid leaks out of the girl's ass) or editing that ruins the continuity of the scene (like magically going from one position to another without showing the transition). And the worst of all is "sneaky" editing, where you get the feeling they may be trying to trick you. For example, I recently saw a scene where there were a couple of quick cuts, right in the middle of an ATM. There were very subtle, and if you had blinked, you would have missed them, but they still ruined the ATM, since there's no way to know whether they were cheating or not. (I don't think they were, since it was a girl I have seen do a lot of ATMs in the past, and there were a couple of other ATMs in the scene with no cuts, but it still makes you wonder what the purpose of the cuts were, if they weren't trying to cheat).

As I said, some amount of editing is inevitable; I wouldn't want to just see raw, totally unedited footage. But if there's any doubt, I think it's best to err on the side of too little editing, rather than too much.

[PC_82]

First of all, why are you replying to a PM in a public thread?

Second of all, I am fully aware that you can't serve one thing to one guy all the time. That's not what I asked for in the PM at all and I have no idea why you're bringing it up here. The PM was about the problems with blurry and poorly-framed cinematography. There were literally three sentences about the fetish stuff. You completely missed the point.

Also, the timecode I mentioned does have some hard pounding with Linda Sweet out of frame, you can hear it in the audio and you can even see a little bit of it as the camera pans away from Katie Gold.

no i seen the raw.. and there is none.. its the same as when it panned over was nothing missed i promise… panned out cause something in lindas ass coming out so had to move out of this shot… or director was speaking to them for next shot..

i cant get any messages seems … they broke something so i cant answer there either.. PM is broken