What do you think about this new business model for porn?

[Chimpy.677]

The traditional porn business seems to be dead, the flow of new young and beautiful models has plummeted, but there is a form of business that could put an end to this and as has been discussed many times here it is related to Crowdfunding, but I am not talking about doing it with AV clients, but rather using clients from other platforms such as OF, Chaturbate, camsoda, CAM4, etc., to finance the scenes of the thousands and thousands of girls that are there.

I think this could work because the great weakness of these pages is that the only good thing they have are the young and beautiful women, but the image quality, shots, male actors, lighting, absolutely everything else is awful, and there are thousands of clients around the world who would like to see their favorite actress from there doing hardcore scenes but those of female models cannot do it because they do not have the infrastructure or experience to film that. And that's where AV studios come in... they could form an alliance by giving their infrastructure (actors, locations, lighting, stage, clothing, cameramen, directors, etc.) and the experience of filming those kinds of scenes.

I'm sure that 99.99% of the men who use those sites would like to see the girls there having DP, DAP scenes and that they would pay and finance the scene to make it happen, but as I said those female models don't have the infrastructure or the experience to do it, but the studios here do.

Keep in mind that one of the best LP/AV actresses, Sofi Smile, before coming to LP/AV was an amateur model from those places...

[Anselm_Weinberg]

I don't like OF, never use it, I don't like the business model and it doesn't work for me as a consumer, but it has basically everything on it, depending on who you sub to, with the exception of the more extreme/niche stuff which is banned, like pee, fisting and prolapse, and that's where platforms like f@nsly, JFF, MV or a multitude of others come in. In fact, some pornstars have even made their first DP/DAP scenes exclusive to their OF. You'll also find most of the top LP girls also have their own platforms, whether it's OF or one or more of the others. It's something that's changed the ENTIRE industry, not just LP, so how you've managed to convince yourself it's got nothing to do with 3rd party platforms and it's all just because LP are making scenes that you, personally, don't like is beyond me.

viewtopic.php?f=96&t=89591

I don't have any insight since I've never used that site at all but I trust the author of this quote. So there is in fact already hardcore stuff over there, need to involve another middleman from their perspective.

[hyapet]

You gotta remember ...

The girl's beauty will make up 99% of the reason people are there. I've come across cam-girls so mind-meltingly gorgeous that I didn't care I was just watching them sit on a messy bed, with terrible lighting, bad sound, completely dressed, bad posture, and talking to three people in chat about the most inane boring shit.

It didn't matter. They were just so fucking hot.

It didn't matter to all the other folks in there throwing money at her like they were trying to put out a fire.

Does nice scenery matter? Sure. Does a good wardrobe count? Absolutely. Does the girl actually getting fucked take it over the top? Of course!

But none of it matters. If the girl is outrageously hot - she can sit there and just slightly jiggle for three hours while completely dressed and she'll walk away with a few thousand dollars, easy.

Meanwhile, are you telling me that all anorexically cardboard thin completely tattooed worst fake tits in the world 45 year olds that saunter through most studio doors these days are suddenly elevated because of the sets and costumes and male talent?

Please.

I mean - think of it this way. You're going out on a date with the most beautiful girl you've ever seen, right? Does the restaurant you go to matter ... to you ? Does what she's wearing factor in at all with the fact that you want to be there? Is there any detail in the world you're going to be focused on during that date that will matter more than her?

No, right ?

Same goes for porn.

[Chimpy.677]

I mean - think of it this way. You're going out on a date with the most beautiful girl you've ever seen, right? Does the restaurant you go to matter ... to you ? Does what she's wearing factor in at all with the fact that you want to be there? Is there any detail in the world you're going to be focused on during that date that will matter more than her?

No, right ?

Same goes for porn.

This is different, because yes, there are thousands and thousands of men amazed watching a girl doing nothing, but THAT DOESN'T TAKE AWAY THE REASON THAT THEY ARE DYING TO SEE HER DOING HARDCORE PORN and as I said, it is something that they know they can't see there because the girls who are there don't have any kind of experience or the infrastructure to do scenes of that type, that's why the studios here would be key because they are people with experience and some already with a reputation that would give them confidence to do that. But the most important thing would be the money that they can make for a single scene, because the men who see that type of women there are capable of disbursing absurd amounts of money if you tell them that they can see their favorite girl in a DP scene. A lot of money moves around in those places and if you promise those people there their dream scene, they are going to invest huge amounts of money for the scene.

[jjwhite1985]

there are thousands and thousands of men amazed watching a girl doing nothing, but THAT DOESN'T TAKE AWAY THE REASON THAT THEY ARE DYING TO SEE HER DOING HARDCORE PORN

I'm interested to know why you're assuming this? The hardcore stuff LP is known for (DP, gangbangs, DAP etc,) is a long way off being the most popular genre of porn.

[Chimpy.677]

there are thousands and thousands of men amazed watching a girl doing nothing, but THAT DOESN'T TAKE AWAY THE REASON THAT THEY ARE DYING TO SEE HER DOING HARDCORE PORN

I'm interested to know why you're assuming this? The hardcore stuff LP is known for (DP, gangbangs, DAP etc,) is a long way off being the most popular genre of porn.

I say this from years and years of experience going into those sites. Other than that, when I refer to LP/AV I always refer to doing classic DP videos Sineplex or Gonzo style many years ago, those videos are still very popular to this day, many have even become classics of hardcore porn. Clearly you are not going to tell one of those girls there to do scenes like the ones they do now here that are disgusting, with vomit, prolapses and urine since they are niche scenes and are extremely unpopular, plus they won't even think about doing them if you tell them that. That's why I say I always talk about classic AV/LP porn from before to do this.

[jjwhite1985]

Right, but vanilla porn is objectively more popular than hardcore style, whether that's DP, DAP, whatever. That's what I was getting at - I don't know why you'd think that most people who subbed to a girls OF wanted to see them doing hardcore scenes as opposed to what they're already doing.

[Chimpy.677]

I don't know why you'd think that most people who subbed to a girls OF wanted to see them doing hardcore scenes as opposed to what they're already doing.

I'm telling you in the post, people want to see it but they can't basically because there are no serious sites that offer that anymore, so most people had to settle with watching these girls doing nothing, but if there was a serious place where these girls could film hardcore scenes, obviously everyone would watch them.

Basically, when you go to these sites you resign yourself to only watching softcore porn or amateur hardcore in very poor quality, that's why it's "popular" because it's the only thing there is.

[jjwhite1985]

Feels like we're going in circles here. There just isn't the demand for this style of porn that you think there is. OF is so big because it offers people what they want - that's how any market works. If it were the other way around then one of the many sites that produces hardcore, professionally produced content would be the biggest platform. Like it or not most people prefer that vanilla stuff over the LP stuff you and I prefer. That's what I meant when I said that vanilla porn was more popular than hardcore porn - things like gangbang and DP rarely feature in any lists of top searched porn. The problem with your hypothetical scenario is that most of the people subscibing to these chicks wouldn't have any interest in seeing them perform in a hardcore studio scene.

[Chimpy.677]

Feels like we're going in circles here. There just isn't the demand for this style of porn that you think there is. OF is so big because it offers people what they want - that's how any market works. If it were the other way around then one of the many sites that produces hardcore, professionally produced content would be the biggest platform. Like it or not most people prefer that vanilla stuff over the LP stuff you and I prefer. That's what I meant when I said that vanilla porn was more popular than hardcore porn - things like gangbang and DP rarely feature in any lists of top searched porn. The problem with your hypothetical scenario is that most of the people subscibing to these chicks wouldn't have any interest in seeing them perform in a hardcore studio scene.

Hardcore porn scenes are by far the most expensive to make, you need a lot of men, girls willing to do things that few would do, etc. That's why getting girls with those characteristics is extremely difficult unless you get a lot of money to pay them, which is impossible with the current system. That's why the public just settles for the basics.
With a high price (with the current system) it seems like there's no demand, but if you could lower the price with another system like Crowdfunding, I'm sure that with lower prices the demand would skyrocket. In addition to this, through Crowdfunding you avoid piracy in a certain way by financing the scene in advance, which would be a much greater incentive for everyone in the company.

[latina-girls-yes]

The traditional porn business seems to be dead, the flow of new young and beautiful models has plummeted, but there is a form of business that could put an end to this and as has been discussed many times here it is related to Crowdfunding, but I am not talking about doing it with AV clients, but rather using clients from other platforms such as OF, Chaturbate, camsoda, CAM4, etc., to finance the scenes of the thousands and thousands of girls that are there

edited for space - see OP at top of page for full comment

OK, i read your pitch and i think i understand your basic premise (correct me if i am wrong);

what you are suggesting is that instead of the CZ studios doing what they currently do (contact models to arrange shoots, who then come into the studios to shoot what the studio wants them to shoot, the model recevies their fee and the studio then handles the distribution and sales of the content),

the initiative instead comes from the fans rather than the studios, who (in discussion with their model) agree a plan about what they want to shoot, crowdfund the cost of hiring a certain studio, director and production/post-production staff (eg. AVLP) to do this, after which the model shoots their scene at the studio and pays the agreed fee, and (after post-production) the studio delivers the final product to the model to distribute to their crowdfunders

is that it?

the first critical problem i see with that is the human factor, which is really a skills/experience problem

studios know what porn production is, what it *really* entails, how the various elements of production need to be staged in order for the thing to come together, how long every element involved in production *really* takes, what works in front of a camera and what doesn't, how every shoot involves professional decisions, compromises, negotiation throughout the process, as they work to turn any plan into a reality

fans know practically none of this (even though many of them are absolutely convinced they know all of it so much better than the studios themselves). and most OF models will also be no wiser to the process of professional studio reality than the fans (so still effectively clueless)

so unless you believe in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance, how are they ever going to be able to come up with a realistic, coherent, costed plan for whatever content they want to shoot, to take to the studio?

they won't, so to bridge that experience/skills deficit, you now need to invent an entire new layer of production (with the extra cost that entails) which will function along the lines of 'professional consultancy'
that would involve experienced xxx professionals a client can approach to break a fantasy shoot idea down into a rational costed plan with timings etc in order to have something meaningful you could take to the studio to ask them to shoot

and what happens if/when this fantasy plan the fans and model have about what they want to shoot starts to breakdown on contact with studio reality?
what if the model can't perform what she thought she could perform? or gets embarrassed doing on set things that she only previously tried in the comfort of her bedroom? or has no concept of professional studio behaviour and starts throwing tantrums and trying to tell everyone there what to do?

this last thing a model (with the backing of her crowdfunders) may feel entitled to do, since (under this new system) you have basically inverted the whole authority and experience structure of studio production, giving those with the least skills and experience the power (as the paying client), and demoting the wisest and most experienced people in the room to mere 'service providers' working to deliver on a (probably poorly or vaguely defined) contract

i could go on, but firstly i doubt any random group of fans and an amateur model would ever be up to the demands of taking responsibility for their part in the process and seeing it through to conclusion
and second (the other side of the equation), i *strongly doubt* any profesional studio would ever want the inevitable headaches that would come with engaging with such a treacherous (weak points throughout) scheme

[hyapet]

None of that matters, latina-girls-yes.

None of it. Same reason why Chimpy.677 didn't quote what really mattered when he responded with this:

This is different, because yes, there are thousands and thousands of men amazed watching a girl doing nothing, but THAT DOESN'T TAKE AWAY THE REASON THAT THEY ARE DYING TO SEE HER DOING HARDCORE PORN

Guess what - it doesn't matter what the fans want. And why doesn't it matter in these particular scenarios? Because - and now I'll quote the part you didn't address:

But none of it matters. If the girl is outrageously hot - she can sit there and just slightly jiggle for three hours while completely dressed and she'll walk away with a few thousand dollars, easy.

Please - explain to me - why a girl who makes money hand over fist doing absolutely fuck all would suddenly decide, hey, you know what? I'm going to start doing some real hardcore porn!

She wouldn't.

She won't.

Which is why the women (now) willing to do this are the ones who couldn't get an audience by doing anything but. Which is why even the most traditional studios are shooting 40 misshapen milfs (who are getting the same rates that the old 18 year old blonde-hair, blue-eyed, DD-bust teens got), and the absolute cream of the crop sites out there that were at the absolute pinnacle of porn? They all share the same (extremely) small handful of models willing to do such acts on camera.

Which explains why Natasha Teen and all the South American studios can still get amazing looking girls. Because the general wealth, security, and networks/infrastructure that's available in the West isn't available to them there. Where the option of a one-time cash pay-out of a couple/few thousand American dollars still pulls weight, and thereby, allows the old system of shooting porn to still exist.

Like - this has all been stated before. But, more importantly, the thing you have to get your head around, Chimpy.677 is that, unlike in the days of yore, it's the models who are in control now. They have their own platform. They're not all lining up to be a part of the record label anymore - they're getting millions of listeners on Spotify.

The real beauties of OF rake in abhorrent amounts of cash. And, if a girl who ===THINKS=== she's pretty (re: all of them) wants to get into the business, she's going to go to the spot where she has to do the least amount of work, talk to the least amount of (greasy) people, and make roughly a thousand times what she would by going through all the extra work and effort.

It's the 7 and 8 out of 10's that are like, "Well, if my beauty alone can't make the cash, maybe I can start branching out into other things ..."

Which is what the problem is. The traditional porn industry is full of 7 and 8 out of 10's. The kind of girl's who would never turn an actual head were they to walk into a room. Your breath isn't being taken away. You look them up and down and are like, "Yeah ..."

Which is exactly where we're already at.

So, no ...

The girl who's on her way to become a millionaire isn't going to suddenly start taking massive black cocks up arse at the same time because the fans already paying her thousands of dollars every day for doing absolutely nothing want her to.

Here's a real quick tip that I think is important for you to figure out, Chimpy.677.

You don't matter.

I don't matter.

The fans don't matter.

We're walking money bags. They see us as nothing more.

If they're getting thousands of dollars for doing fuck all - then honestly - as far as they're concerned - you can take all the fantasies you want to see become reality - write them down on a piece of paper - and throw them in the trash.

Simple as that.

[jjwhite1985]

Hardcore porn scenes are by far the most expensive to make, you need a lot of men, girls willing to do things that few would do, etc. That's why getting girls with those characteristics is extremely difficult unless you get a lot of money to pay them, which is impossible with the current system. That's why the public just settles for the basics.
With a high price (with the current system) it seems like there's no demand, but if you could lower the price with another system like Crowdfunding, I'm sure that with lower prices the demand would skyrocket. In addition to this, through Crowdfunding you avoid piracy in a certain way by financing the scene in advance, which would be a much greater incentive for everyone in the company.

Dude it's like you're just talking around me. Re-read the last sentence of the comment you're responding to. Most of the public PREFER that vanilla stuff, it's what they want to see. Or do you think that if only they could be exposed to hardcore porn they'd suddenly realize what they were missing out on? Tastes differ man, LP was never the most popular porn site on the internet because it's never been the most popular style of porn.

Add to that latina-girls-yes and hyapet are both correct. The multiple logistical problems would be impossible to overcome. And, contrary to what many on this forum like to believe, most girls don't actually want to be constantly railed by multiple cocks. It's not for the faint hearted, and with the odd exception, 99% would choose more money for easier work if they had the option.

[dap-addict]

...with the odd exception, 99% would choose more money for easier work if they had the option.

Exactly!