Twisting the girl's arm behind her back in doggy - why?

[TheVulture]

As for "always complaining" that just shows that you're not paying attention. I post tons of positive stuff where I think it's due, usually in the girls' own threads. You obviously just see what you want to see and which fits your agenda, which is IMHO being a "white knight" protecting LP against nasty people who say anything negative about them, however constructively.

[netzerkaiser]

As for "always complaining" that just shows that you're not paying attention. I post tons of positive stuff where I think it's due, usually in the girls' own threads. You obviously just see what you want to see and which fits your agenda, which is IMHO being a "white knight" protecting LP against nasty people who say anything negative about them, however constructively.

I think you're a great guy & I really admire how you stood your ground on the Giorgio forum. You've guts & you've principles. That can only be respected.

[Starrio]

I give you the benefit of the doubt since I haven't read all your posts, but all the ones I have seen from you are complaining for something that obviously sells and that many people like including me.

Your trolling usually comes in the form of saying that these girls are being taken advantage of, as opposed of saying you don't like domination. Those are different things.

Yes, I love when the girl gets dominated, but other guys like to be dominated and that's fine too. Domination is key for a very good scene in my book, and many paying costumers like that, that's why they do it because money talks.

However I also agree that hard sex is important.

We can agree that going balls deep is the most important part in a scene. I would rather have a girl getting deep rectum penetration than just playing with her arms or legs.

Many of the guys on LP aren't that big, Dylan is big and he still goes balls deep, so there is no excuse for these guys not going balls deep. They should always go balls deep specially when they are not even big.

I can agree on that part, that's always more important than playing with the girls arms and legs, but that stuff is fun too.

[TheVulture]

Your trolling usually comes in the form of saying that these girls are being taken advantage of, as opposed of saying you don't like domination. Those are different things.

Firstly, I'm not trolling so I would recommend you stop using that word. It just shows a lack of faith in your own position and IMHO makes you look a bit pathetic.

Secondly, neither of us know whether any of these girls are being taken advantage of. I think some of them are, you don't. All you really do is imply a sort of "status quo" position as some kind of proof, ie "well the scenes exist and the girls haven't complained explicit on this forum so it is all fine". That's a very weak position to take. Again I will refer you to my general points of instances where I'm fairly confident the girl hasn't liked it (which obviously would suggest it wasn't pre-agreed). Neither my case nor yours is cast iron. If you want to rebut my suggestion that sometimes arm-twisting is used by a guy as a default thing with a girl who doesn't like it then you'll have to do better than your very casual/flimsy arguments thus far. "They love it because they love anal sex". Goodness me. By the same token I accept that I can't prove my case either. All I can do is put forward my opinions based on stuff that I've seen. More generally though, the idea that male porn guys are beyond reproach and never overstep the mark in any scenes is clearly absurd. I have over 20 years of evidence from watching porn to know that these things do happen. It's basically a combination of testosterone, ego and entitlement and is one of those things that is really inevitable unless it is checked (eg by a strong producer). I could also give some specifics from LP based on throat-grabbing to essentially prove that point but that isn't really for this thread. I might try to find some based on arm-twisting but the examples are a little more subtle. Also I don't know if I can genuinely be bothered. That wasn't really the point of this. The point really was to have a sensible discussion about it and I expected better (as I always would) than cheap accusations of trolling.

There are more people in this thread that agree with me than disagree. That tells me that ultimately it was worth it and that hopefully LP are taking note.

[Starrio]

Stop making shit up, first you were complaining about using the word pathetic, which I didn't use, now you are actually using it, so you are being the pathetic now just for that hypocrisy alone, not to mention anything else.

Also I never said they love it because they are doing anal, stop making shit up, I said it's not a big deal in a situation when they are actually doing anal, that's just common sense.

Then they are not getting hurt, you make it sound like they are getting hurt.

On top of that is just putting the arms behind there is nothing abusive about that, how much ridiculous can you be?

This is what I mean when I say you sound like a troll saying those things.

As if you want to point out fingers to LP for doing some kind of shady business, are you one of those Woodman trolls?

[TheVulture]

Stop making shit up, first you were complaining about using the word pathetic, which I didn't use, now you are actually using it, so you are being the pathetic now just for that hypocrisy alone, not to mention anything else.

I didn't complain about you using the word pathetic. I said I thought you were pathetic for calling me a troll. You were the one who misinterpreted that and now it's a weird obsession to you for some reason.

Also I never said they love it because they are doing anal

Yes you did. That is exactly what you said. The thread is here for everyone to see.

I find you quite dull and you have this ultra thin skin about any criticism of your beloved LP and its untouchable male performers. I don't really see any sense in us discussing this further. I have enjoyed the contributions of most of the other posters.

[TheVulture]

It's pretty safe to assume they love it. These girls are giving away their large intestine for penetration, what more proof do you need?

Just to remind Starrio of what he said as he seems to be forgetful as well as tedious.

[netzerkaiser]

Two great guys, why argue? Both cool guys.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dLxpNiF0YKs

[bake0213]

I wonder how much a custom rough scene would cost with the model gasping as she is being choked "this one's for you the Vulture!"

[TheVulture]

I wonder how much a custom rough scene would cost with the model gasping as she is being choked "this one's for you the Vulture!"

Well it would be a waste of money however much, because I would never see it.

[Starrio]

It's pretty safe to assume they love it. These girls are giving away their large intestine for penetration, what more proof do you need?

Just to remind Starrio of what he said as he seems to be forgetful as well as tedious.

Ok maybe I forgot that big deal, you also forgot about the pathetic thing, on the Oliver Turk thread, but at least I'm not going around making unfair accusations on every comment.

I'm not saying you can't complain, what got me is that you were trolling on every single thread and it started looking toxic.

Specially when you are accusing without bases. You just assume the girls are being tortured like some kind of traffic cartel, absolutely ridiculous.

If you don't want to be so annoying just pick one thread and bitch there all you want, but don't go around on every thread making toxicity.

Otherwise it will prove again you are just trolling, probably Woodman fan trolling.

[TheVulture]

Ok maybe I forgot that big deal, you also forgot about the pathetic thing

I forgot what on what pathetic thing?

Again remember the comments are still in this thread.

Do you need me to re-quote again like with this last one?

[TheVulture]

This is straight trolling you are doing.

As for "trolling", pathetic. Just don't engage if that's the best you can do.

I'll just leave this here for Starrio to explain what is so complicated about it and how I apparently missed something.

[TheVulture]

You just assume the girls are being tortured like some kind of traffic cartel, absolutely ridiculous.

Hysterical much?

Any specific examples of where I claim this?

You're just rehashing old ground, aren't you? I'm really not sure how many times I have to explain my position or quite how more constructive I can be about it. I think you should just admit that you got a bit muddled and made some false assumptions and leave it at that. And definitely stop still playing the troll card, which is just beyond embarrassing.

[Starrio]

Yeah that one. You found it. You basically were saying I was calling you pathetic, and I didn't, then you called me pathetic, and now you were the hypocrite.

About the trolling to be fair I haven't seen you trolling since I called you on it, so that's a good thing.

I usually don't mind if you ask for more scenes that aren't rough, just hard as you say. What is annoying is when you start implying that the girls are actually getting abused by LP and that makes everything toxic.

There is a fine line there and that level of toxicity is what makes you appear Woodman trolling, but when you don't do that you are totally fine.

[TheVulture]

You basically were saying I was calling you pathetic, and I didn't, then you called me pathetic, and now you were the hypocrite.

I think we've already been through this, haven't we? I never said you called me pathetic, I said you were pathetic for calling me a troll. See the 2 quotes I just highlighted. After that I've no idea why you got so muddled up over this "pathetic" angle or how you think it somehow makes me a hypocrite.

[Starrio]

I think we've already been through this, haven't we? I never said you called me pathetic, I said you were pathetic for calling me a troll. See the 2 quotes I just highlighted. After that I've no idea why you got so muddled up over this "pathetic" angle or how you think it somehow makes me a hypocrite.

There is nothing more pathetic than being a hypocrite by denying your Ill intentions when making comments to harm the site. Any time you claim the girls are being abused for insignificant things, that's pathetic. Don't you have testosterone, balls, testicles? Leave the poor girls alone instead of trying to create a victim narrative about their work, making them feel like shit for no reason. It's stupid, all these stupid ideas that women are being abused for engaging in sex acts is as misogynistic as it gets. You are accusing people of something you are guilty of by embracing those narratives that are false and deceitful. Doesn't your chest hurt for being that low of a person? I don't understand how people like you can live with yourself. All this political zombie shit is absolutely disgusting. Respect yourself by not falling into becoming the type of poop that makes society be a shithole for those that buy into that nonsense.

[TheVulture]

There is nothing more pathetic than being a hypocrite by denying your Ill intentions when making comments to harm the site. Any time you claim the girls are being abused for insignificant things, that's pathetic. Don't you have testosterone, balls, testicles? Leave the poor girls alone instead of trying to create a victim narrative about their work, making them feel like shit for no reason. It's stupid, all these stupid ideas that women are being abused for engaging in sex acts is as misogynistic as it gets. You are accusing people of something you are guilty of by embracing those narratives that are false and deceitful. Doesn't your chest hurt for being that low of a person? I don't understand how people like you can live with yourself. All this political zombie shit is absolutely disgusting. Respect yourself by not falling into becoming the type of poop that makes society be a shithole for those that buy into that nonsense.

Well I think that's quite the most bizarre thing I've ever heard. That by calling out what I see as unnecessarily aggressive sex acts that are used by default (and this is the important thing here - as I repeatedly say I have no issue with manhandle scenes with girls who clearly enjoy it) I'm somehow acting in opposition to the girls and their ability to take part in porn. That just sounds to me like a massive smokescreen to cover up your own insecurities about the fact that you like this stuff and basically give every male producing or appearing in porn free rein to do whatever they want on the grounds of "the girls know what they're letting themselves in for". Very weak sauce my friend and certainly has zero impact here.

Don't I have balls? Testosterone? Yes, obviously. This is just rehashing old ground, isn't it? The idea that porn sex must by definition involve men being physically aggressive. Well, no. Sexually elite with hardcore drive and stamina? Yes. Physically aggressive with their hands? No - that is very much niche and obviously not all girls like that, however hardcore they are sexually. I think you know this but again, you like it so you want it to be universal and are thus keen to either silence or shame those who don't agree with you, which is risible really.

There are quite a lot of people who agree with me in this thread so it's very interesting that you are prepared to label us all as enemies of LP who are in some way trying to damage the site, rather than simply making a courteous call to cater for different types of porn consumer other than the lowest common denominator. It is pretty flimsy, desperate and transparent stuff. In terms of a "political" angle you seem to be basically trying to silence us all from putting forward constructive criticism, which is all that has been aired here. You can go away and have a think who should really be feeling guilty here. I'm perfectly happy with everything I've said here, thank you very much, and will continue to keep saying it as long as I feel it is necessary.

Oh and finally, have a look at some of my comments in the girls' own threads then come back and tell me that I'm trying to shame them or deny them a career in porn.

[Starrio]

Either you can't reason or you just like to troll.

In simple words you are always trying to make manhandle as you call it now, sound immoral, when is just sex. There is nothing immoral about it.

My has always been that if you don't like manhandle that's fine, but when you cross the line to make it sound immoral that's when you start sounding like a troll.

[TheVulture]

Either you can't reason or you just like to troll.

In simple words you are always trying to make manhandle as you call it now, sound immoral, when is just sex. There is nothing immoral about it.

My has always been that if you don't like manhandle that's fine, but when you cross the line to make it sound immoral that's when you start sounding like a troll.

I see....basically you don't have the capacity to address any of my specific points or develop the discussion in any sensible and meaningful way so it's back to the "troll" thing.

I think our back-and-forth on this has now run its course and people can draw their own conclusions based on the contents of the thread. Hopefully others will choose to develop the topic as they see fit.

[Starrio]

I did detail everything many times, I even made it simple so you can understand, but you still avoid it, and jus focus on the troll part, I have to mention the troll part because that's exactly how it sounds.

I even made clear the distinction many times when you are trolling and when you are not.